The Roof Will Be Open

[SF2K4]

Just my $0.02... regardless of the venue, be it outdoor or dome, no stadium will ever be truly "ideal" for the marching activity... sure, there are some that are very, VERY good and some that are definitely better than others but the fact is we march on FOOTBALL FIELDS (though we'd like to think they simply play football on our drum corps fields ) and as such they are designed for the FOOTBALL atmosphere: They are meant to be LOUD, to REVERBERATE, and to REFLECT all the noise back to the playing surface and all around the stadium because that makes for a great FOOTBALL atmosphere. The best bet from a sound perspective for our activity is to be as open air as possible.

[IntheMood]

Amps did not have a huge effect on drum corps. I'm sorry, but placing a mic on a marimba is hardly a big deal, other than making the pit sound better.

tell that to the people who walked away because of amps. Like I did, but I did come back.

Have you looked at the videos on the fan network on DCI.org? Fan disconnect is indeed talked about. To me it is clear that DCI is indeed recognizing that there is a disconnect and they are in the process of taking the first steps to address the disconnect between their customers and the product on the field.

Dean

[jpaul]

If the ethnic and racial makeup of this country is changing (and it is), then DCI should have reached out to minority groups, to recruit them into the activity. (By the year 2050, there will be no majority racial or ethnic group in this country. If the traditional recruiting base for corps is from non-Hispanic white people, then DCI needs to begin aggressively recruiting from minority groups, today.)

A) DCI doesn't recruit kids. Corps recruit kids.

B) Where do you get that corps are "targeting" white kids? I personally know lots of kids of all different colors who march drum corps.

[jpaul]

[*]The judging article - I didn't see it as fluff or trying to sweep things other the rug - read closely, there were some valid points, and some points actually work against LOS & the direction of the activity: 1) the visual judges seemed to love the venue - no surprise there, and to me underscores a fundamental problem with DCI - a continued migration to too much weight on visual at the expense of music. 2) The judges felt like there was not a competitive advantage or disadvantage - agreed again - our judges are good at what they do. 3) Some openly commented that the fan experience was different for fans/listeners (and not positive)

I don't see the relation here. Are you implying that DCI deliberately chose the venue because they knew it would be good for visual folks and bad for music folks?

[garfield]

Wow, what a 33 page read! Just some somewhat random thoughts on the whole thing:

• I really, really appreciate Bob (AND DCI) starting to open up more on these topics, and it IS a good marketing strategy to do so.
  
• I also applaud DCI for at least trying to open the roof and see what happens.
  
• Count me among those that think it will not make much difference
  
• I also think there is little competitive advantage either way - our judges are too good at what they do for that to be the case.
  
• The judging article - I didn't see it as fluff or trying to sweep things other the rug - read closely, there were some valid points, and some points actually work against LOS & the direction of the activity: 1) the visual judges seemed to love the venue - no surprise there, and to me underscores a fundamental problem with DCI - a continued migration to too much weight on visual at the expense of music. 2) The judges felt like there was not a competitive advantage or disadvantage - agreed again - our judges are good at what they do. 3) Some openly commented that the fan experience was different for fans/listeners (and not positive)
  
• To me, the real problem was the decision to go to LOS for 10 years. I still believe this a musical activity that should NOT be indoors unless the weather conditions are just in-hospitable (San Antonio is the posterchild for the value of an indoor show). Second - as a fan, regardless of location, I still hate that we are going the same place for so many years.
  
• I tend to ignore all Mike's posts - makes this site more rational.
  
• Jeff was spot on with a key point - the emergence of Crown & Phantom with highly entertaining, MUSICAL shows has done a great deal to stem a potential tide of disaffected fans from leaving. The jury is still out on whether DCI course corrects there, or continues down to the path to an general ever increasing emphasis on visual and winterguard components. We'll see!
  
• I would NEVER recommend fans abandoning this activity, nor will I - I love it far too much, and have for all 21 years I've marched, then followed it as a fan, including 21 straight DCI Championships
  
• LOS as a venue is second only to Jackson, MS as a venue for finals. :( While I will continue to go, my enthusiasm has been measurably impacted by the fact Finals will continue to be there.
  

Just my random thoughts. Again, Kudos to a DCI Director willing to engage in meaningful dialogue! Great to see.

Harvey

Is it OK to just say "Ditto"?

Excellent post

[cowtown]

I’m one of those some label as a complainer and recently I have been.

But I feel it’s entirely justified. I feel DCI misled me about the dome, sold it as a retractable roof stadium which is a dome when it’s closed. Then they insulted me at Indy, to my face when I politely asked a DCI staffer about the status of the roof. Then they lied to me when I emailed and spoke with my Friends of DCI rep and they said I’d get a survey. I never did, I was given dates as to when to expect it, I followed up with them at least 3 times and only Bob here followed up with me from DCI... or offered to follow up on my behalf, I refused his offer but thanked him. His telling me how great my DCI Friends rep was however, to say the least, grating. Hey, she might be a lot of laughs around the office and a super gal but she should know how to pick up a phone, send an email, and give accurate information, right? Again, just another acceptance of poor business skills being excused and condoned by DCI. It seems to be their culture. Ever interaction I have with DCI I am judging them just as I expect my customers do to me and my company, they don't seem to get this concept. Then that article about the judges was horrible, all the way around. I was done giving them the benefit of the doubt. So I feel DCI lied to me repeatedly and ripped me off personally. I’d have to be a complete moron to trust them after all that, wouldn’t I?

My personal interactions with DCI as of recent have shown them to be lacking professionalism. My observation of them have borne the same conclusions. It so happens that I work in several related fields that DCI works in and I see many things that suggest they could be doing a better job or are not being forthright with the information which, they don’t have to be but then they have to be better at controlling the message. They are terrible at that and its results in them looking even more unprofessional.

Frankly, I’m not sold on Bob here as all I’ve seen so far is lip service. I’ve been burnt too many times by DCI's lip service to buy anything before I see it. The missing articles are just that, missing, another undelivered promise sugar coated with excuses and his explanation is rather tardy, its rather unprofessional don't ch think? I do. Here is a tip, mange client expectations, promise low and deliver big. Something most people in sales or PR know by the end of their first day. I also find Bob’s tone and attitude is a bit too glib considering his mission here and his titles. He should be up above it and if he wants to get down in it, he needs a different handle where he is not identified as a DCI rep. He has all the sincerity of a youth group Amway sales rep playing hip with a ponytail while trying to sell you shineola. Maybe thats sounds harsh, but its meant to be funny and show you how I feel, how bitter I am as a result of this past year in dealing with DCI

All too often I see DCI claim its run as a business and all too often I see people treat it as a charity, it’s neither. Generally, I think the Pollyanna apologist do the most harm to DCI. They allow and further enable DCI to be run into the ground and then turn around and absolve them of any responsibility for their poor decisions. And what you pollyannas call criticisms I call teaching moment, I'm all about tough love baby

It’s off season, generally a time of reflection and review, time to set new goals and means to achieve those goals. It’s the unpleasant, dirty, difficult business that most professional people have to do at least once a year to themselves. For me, 2009 was about the worst year I’ve seen from DCI

I may attend a DCI roundtable, my meeting with a DCI person over the holiday season was a complete failure so I’m a motivated to try again. Maybe I should sell tickets to come and meet Cowtown face to face and get some more of you freaks there

[garfield]

A) DCI doesn't recruit kids. Corps recruit kids.

B) Where do you get that corps are "targeting" white kids? I personally know lots of kids of all different colors who march drum corps.

I can't find your original post, OldSchool, but read this reply referencing it and, I gotta say, this is the most ludicrus rationale I've heard in a long time. I can't think of a more inclusive activity than drum corps. For as long as I can remember there are (were) All-Girl, Oriental, Mexican, etc dominated corps. And corps that don't have a clear majority of one ethnic group have a high degree of ethnic particiapation anyway.

I've never known DCI to "target" any particular group of kids besides those who want to march, have the talent, and aren't a disruption. Don't forget the roots of the activity is in getting kids off the street!

Today you've got southern, northern, east and west, white, red, brown, black, and green (sick at the back of the bus) kids involved.

If your argument weren't bombastic on it's face I'd ask for data or statistical proof. But, for the same reason, it's not worth the effort.

[Jeff Ream]

A) DCI doesn't recruit kids. Corps recruit kids.

B) Where do you get that corps are "targeting" white kids? I personally know lots of kids of all different colors who march drum corps.

yep. I've yet to see a corps target a certain demographic. let's be honest....even at the scholastic level, the activity is kinda pale....but that isn't by choice or lack of effort

[Jeff Ream]

I'm one of those some label as a complainer and recently I have been.

But I feel it's entirely justified. I feel DCI misled me about the dome, sold it as a retractable roof stadium which is a dome when it's closed. Then they insulted me at Indy, to my face when I politely asked a DCI staffer about the status of the roof. Then they lied to me when I emailed and spoke with my Friends of DCI rep and they said I'd get a survey. I never did, I was given dates as to when to expect it, I followed up with them at least 3 times and only Bob here followed up with me from DCI... or offered to follow up on my behalf, I refused his offer but thanked him. His telling me how great my DCI Friends rep was however, to say the least, grating. Hey, she might be a lot of laughs around the office and a super gal but she should know how to pick up a phone, send an email, and give accurate information, right? Again, just another acceptance of poor business skills being excused and condoned by DCI. It seems to be their culture. Ever interaction I have with DCI I am judging them just as I expect my customers do to me and my company, they don't seem to get this concept. Then that article about the judges was horrible, all the way around. I was done giving them the benefit of the doubt. So I feel DCI lied to me repeatedly and ripped me off personally. I'd have to be a complete moron to trust them after all that, wouldn't I?

My personal interactions with DCI as of recent have shown them to be lacking professionalism. My observation of them have borne the same conclusions. It so happens that I work in several related fields that DCI works in and I see many things that suggest they could be doing a better job or are not being forthright with the information which, they don't have to be but then they have to be better at controlling the message. They are terrible at that and its results in them looking even more unprofessional.

Frankly, I'm not sold on Bob here as all I've seen so far is lip service. I've been burnt too many times by DCI's lip service to buy anything before I see it. The missing articles are just that, missing, another undelivered promise sugar coated with excuses and his explanation is rather tardy, its rather unprofessional don't ch think? I do. Here is a tip, mange client expectations, promise low and deliver big. Something most people in sales or PR know by the end of their first day. I also find Bob's tone and attitude is a bit too glib considering his mission here and his titles. He should be up above it and if he wants to get down in it, he needs a different handle where he is not identified as a DCI rep. He has all the sincerity of a youth group Amway sales rep playing hip with a ponytail while trying to sell you shineola. Maybe thats sounds harsh, but its meant to be funny and show you how I feel, how bitter I am as a result of this past year in dealing with DCI

All too often I see DCI claim its run as a business and all too often I see people treat it as a charity, it's neither. Generally, I think the Pollyanna apologist do the most harm to DCI. They allow and further enable DCI to be run into the ground and then turn around and absolve them of any responsibility for their poor decisions. And what you pollyannas call criticisms I call teaching moment, I'm all about tough love baby

It's off season, generally a time of reflection and review, time to set new goals and means to achieve those goals. It's the unpleasant, dirty, difficult business that most professional people have to do at least once a year to themselves. For me, 2009 was about the worst year I've seen from DCI

I may attend a DCI roundtable, my meeting with a DCI person over the holiday season was a complete failure so I'm a motivated to try again. Maybe I should sell tickets to come and meet Cowtown face to face and get some more of you freaks there

I'll agree with you on more than a few points, but I'll disagree 10000000000000% about Bob Jacobs. Even if we don't like his answers, he is not going to stick his ### out on here and tell bold faced lies. The man has integrity to spare, and his appearances and candidness here have been one of the best things DCI has done PR wise in decades.

[Fred Windish]

SF2K4 touched upon a revelation I had the other evening. It totally changed my perspective of current DCI show design and music. I watched the entire 2009 Championship DVD set. I do have a nice set-up, by the way. I viewed the event on a 56 inch, hi-def tv with 5.1 surround sound.

The performances were MAGNIFICENT! I understood the addition/use of amplification, pre-show. The dance/body movements, uniform/costumes, were first rate. Seeing the emotional facial expressions was priceless. The sound (likely re-touched in post-production) was outstanding. I didn't miss any highlights, again due to post production. All presentations were well-conceived and blended into a unified package. What a show!

My belief is this. . .

The elements I witnessed on DVD do NOT translate adequately when viewed from a seat at a football stadium. The product DCI now provides is being shortchanged by the "stage" from which it's presented. A stage that restricts the audience from fully appreciating the total quality of the package.

Therein lies the problem, I think.

If you can, watch this year's DVDs. Compare what you see and feel at this advantage to your experience from the bleachers. The difference is stunning. In many ways, DCI is better than it has ever been.

Thoughts?