A Drum Corps Blind Spot

[BozzlyB]

I say we should call in Queer Guys for a Staff make Over for all the corps

BAAAAhAAAAhaaaaaaaa!!!

[BRASSO]

So are you saying that dress does matter? C'mon. Which is it? Either there is some sort of objective standard or there isn't. Now, our lines of appropriateness might be in different places, but I think everyone here would say there is some kind of line that should not be crossed.

Well of course there are limits on attire. ( like limits on everything else ). A staff member can't go to practice in a g string... or worse.... completely nude but with sneakers on. Get a grip, Granny. Nobody' s talking here on the need for " NO LIMITS " on staff attire and cleanliness.

I havn't heard or seen of one instance over the years of a staff member being so blatantly unkempt and dishevelled that it became a distraction to the public at large. There might have been a time or two perhaps when it became an issue at practice, in which case it was probably handled internally by the Corps Director or someone in charge so that it did not become a distaction to the others in the Corps.

Are you and others been upset at the attire worn by certain DCI Corps staff in public lately ? If so, give us some specific examples of what in their attire or hygiene bothered you, so we might be better able to understand what you're referring to here re. inappropriate attire and/ or personal hygiene by DCI Corps staff.

Edited May 7, 2010 by BRASSO

[It's Godzilla!]

Wow, I know DCP is good at derailing threads, but... wow.

Here's how I interpreted the first post: In an activity where we focus so greatly on minute details and improving the smallest of errors, we should be focused on the small things ALL the time, if not always, then at least when in uniform or performing. How the staff dresses was just one example of how this idea sometimes falls through the cracks.

How you interpreted it: A critique of staff members' apparel and grooming habits. ...And then argued about nothing else for 13 pages.

Let me preface this by saying I'm not old. I aged out in '08. ...And I completely agree with Granny Smith. Uniform etiquette was a HUGE deal where I came from. That being so, I cringe every time I see a corp walk to the gate chatting away out of step, or walk out of formation onto the field. Why do we polish the horns, shine our shoes, shave, etc. if we're just going to give it away by looking like crap walking on to the field? Why does the staff insist on making us polish our horns, shine our shoes, shave, etc. if there's even the possibility of making the corps look bad by dressing inappropriately? These are the little things that are indicative of bigger things. I once watched a member take off every article of clothing that was even close to our corps colours before he went to buy beer because of how it would affect the image of the corps. That's discipline. That's the kind of thing I assume Granny finds lacking. The problem with saying "Who cares?" is that it can easily be applied to anything under the right circumstances. Do it long enough, and you lower your standards.

But to respond to the derailment, my corps had a rule for that, which trumped all other rules:

Rule#1: Always look good.

[luvscorps]

The post of the year!

[whitedawn]

But to respond to the derailment, my corps had a rule for that, which trumped all other rules:

Rule#1: Always look good.

the ultimate truth.

[chaos001]

Maybe we should return to the usual DCP recipe: bashing electronics, DCI and slotting. In contrast to this insistence on fashion freedom, I'm getting nostalgic for the quaint discourse that usually passes for logic around here.

Next topic: Hygiene only matters when there is disease involved.

Followed by: Sexual harassment is really a communications issue.

Still to come: Anarchy is easier.

HH

thanks for almost making me ruin a $2000 laptop...diet coke was about to spew everywhere.

But to respond to the derailment, my corps had a rule for that, which trumped all other rules:

Rule#1: Always look good.

game.set.match.

[corpsband]

A couple of snippets from your reply. Am I confused? Yes.

You go from giving a relativistic statement that there is nothing objective to saying that dress does matter sometimes (to which i say, says who? You?) back to saying it doesn't matter again.

So really what you're saying is that we should only exercise excellence sometimes. This is precisely why I used the subtitle I did: "The Affliction of Mediocrity" because some believe that excellence and integrity are only important when we're in the spotlight. I say those character traits need to be present FIRST when nobody is watching.

You've made the interstellar leap of equating poster design and staff dress code to integrity and excellence. Please share your warp drive technology with the rest of the earth. Dress code or artistic tour poster design is not the same as integrity or excellence.

Yes there are times when a focus on dress code matters (ie when you are a member of a drum corps performing in public). And there are time when it does not (ie in the middle of a drum corps practice). It's called situational awareness. I would not enter a hospital operating room and be offended by people wearing blood-covered pajamas! But wearing clothing which (a) maximizes comfort (b) requires no thought to choose © can be recycled indefinitely is appropriate to the circumstance -- just like it is on hot summer day on 110° astroturf !

Your attempt to foist your vision of a dress code takes no account of this. And (of course) you failed to address any of points I raised in my reply. As I am approaching old age myself I will of course forgive this oversight and re-state those points again (which you carefully avoided in your snippet) :

Learning to focus on the essential and disregarding the superficial is one of the best lessons of the whole DC experience. Being able to put aside all the things which ordinarily are essential in the real world and just focus on marching, playing, and spinning is part of the drum corps experience. You learn not to be distracted by other things and focus solely on attaining excellence, even if it makes you so dirty, stinky, and poorly dressed that it offends Granny. Because Granny doesnt matter on the practice field -- neither does rain, sun, turf turds all over your body. Nothing matters but improving your performance and by extension the performance of the rest of the 149 members sharing the field with you.

In fact I'm usually so mesmerized by the discipline and focus of the performers on a practice field that I hardly notice at all what they are wearing. They are showing attention to every little detail THAT MATTERS and ignoring everything else. To me this represents dedication to excellence and integrity -- not their t-shirts, sports bras, and smelly sneakers.

Finally your claim that people are offended by what a staff choses to wear at a show is overblown. I've brought many a newb to drumcorps shows (never mind sitting near them) and never -- not once -- have I heard or seen them paying any attention at all to the corps staff as they enter never mind the corps staffs' wardrobe. In fact their eyes are glued to other much more interesting things at shows (ie the performers!)

You may take offense at these sub-par show posters and poorly dressed staff (and that's ok -- you're certainly privileged to be offended) but don't try to paint an entire corps or activity with such a broad brush merely because you choose to take offense.

Edited May 7, 2010 by corpsband

[kdaddy]

Granny - agree 100%. Some folks are short-sighted, especially in the posters thread, but marketing is incredibly important. That's really the greater issue.

Another anecdotal example from a different context... the football announcing team for my alma mater, a traditional football powerhouse, is by most accounts TERRIBLE. The play-by-play guy is ancient, and the color guy is not far from it. They simply aren't effective anymore. Will a change in the broadcast team change the outcome of the football game? Of course not. Will a change bring in any more revenue or create new fans that didn't exist previously? Doubtful. But ultimately, the broadcast team is a negative for the football program, athletic department, and, to some extent, the image that the university is trying to build.

Yes, poster/image quality matters. Yes, staff decorum matters. Yes, web presence matters. Yes, press releases matter. It's the whole package, which includes performance and entertainment value, among many otheres.

I disagree with the suggestion that one of the above will not matter if the corps wins the title. If PR wins the title, I'll think "man, wish the logo was befitting of that championship corps." When the firing of PR's color guard designer was completely handled poorly on DCP following their title, I thought "man, wish they marketed like a champion."

That being said, I'm still looking forward to Kamen arrangements and Rosander drill, but that doesn't mean that other aspects of the whole package can't disappoint me... :)

[BRASSO]

Granny is clearly able to speak for herself, and needs no interpreter .I'll respond to her reply to my question above if she's so inclined to respond to it when she returns.' Nite all .

Edited May 7, 2010 by BRASSO

[BRASSO]

You've made the interstellar leap of equating poster design and staff dress code to integrity and excellence. Please share your warp drive technology with the rest of the earth. Dress code or artistic tour poster design is not the same as integrity or excellence.

Yes there are times when a focus on dress code matters (ie when you are a member of a drum corps performing in public). And there are time when it does not (ie in the middle of a drum corps practice). It's called situational awareness. I would not enter a hospital operating room and be offended by people wearing blood-covered pajamas! But wearing clothing which (a) maximizes comfort (b) requires no thought to choose © can be recycled indefinitely is appropriate to the circumstance -- just like it is on hot summer day on 110° astroturf !

Your attempt to foist your vision of a dress code takes no account of this. And (of course) you failed to address any of points I raised in my reply. As I am approaching old age myself I will of course forgive this oversight and re-state those points again (which you carefully avoided in your snippet) :

Learning to focus on the essential and disregarding the superficial is one of the best lessons of the whole DC experience. Being able to put aside all the things which ordinarily are essential in the real world and just focus on marching, playing, and spinning is part of the drum corps experience. You learn not to be distracted by other things and focus solely on attaining excellence, even if it makes you so dirty, stinky, and poorly dressed that it offends Granny. Because Granny doesnt matter on the practice field -- neither does rain, sun, turf turds all over your body. Nothing matters but improving your performance and by extension the performance of the rest of the 149 members sharing the field with you.

In fact I'm usually so mesmerized by the discipline and focus of the performers on a practice field that I hardly notice at all what they are wearing. They are showing attention to every little detail THAT MATTERS and ignoring everything else. To me this represents dedication to excellence and integrity -- not their t-shirts, sports bras, and smelly sneakers.

Finally your claim that people are offended by what a staff choses to wear at a show is overblown. I've brought many a newb to drumcorps shows (never mind sitting near them) and never -- not once -- have I heard or seen them paying any attention at all to the corps staff as they enter never mind the corps staffs' wardrobe. In fact their eyes are glued to other much more interesting things at shows (ie the performers!)

You may take offense at these sub-par show posters and poorly dressed staff (and that's ok -- you're certainly privileged to be offended) but don't try to paint an entire corps or activity with such a broad brush merely because you choose to take offense.

This is a well articulated,reasonable way to look at this, imo. Your sentiments expressed with these comments are pretty much in total sync with my position on this, fwiw. You gave excellent examples here I thought to explain how the pursuit of excellence needs to be seen thru the prism of the situation with the choices we make at that given moment in time. I've never heard before anyone focus on how staff are dressed on the stadium track for the few moments their Corps comes out to compete. Granny made a good point in her initial remarks about the need of the Corps staff and Directors to pursue excellence in a number of areas unrelated to performance on the field. It's a good point, with no argument. In retrospect however, she might have used a better example to illustrate her point than using the DCI staff's personal hygiene and attire at practices and at shows as one of her examples in her initial comment after she started her thread. I just don't see that DCI today has much of a problem with staffs attire and personal hygiene issues. Had Granny not used this as her example to buffer her point, no doubt the overblown and thoroughly unimportant issue of how staff dress at practices and shows on summer tours would not have come up at all.

Edited May 7, 2010 by BRASSO