DCI story on CNN.com

[EllmerFUDD]

It might be painful and risky, but perhaps it might be time to call it a day as far as DCI goes. The lower echelon corps have become nothing more than a supporting cast for the top 7. They get inferior housing, travel further, expend more $ and diesel just getting to shows, and receive comparatively little compensation, along with having their ranks raided for top talent every year.

1) No one travels further than SCV and BD

2) The top Corps just hold audtions, they dont "Raid" the lower corps

3) Maybe we should just prevent kinds in lower Corps from the opportunity to march where they want

4) Many of the top corps today at one time were lower leverl corps. They all spent 30-40 years getting to where they are. Check out where SCV abd BD's came from.

[sarnia sam]

As someone who does television news every day and writes features on a regular basis for newspapers, this CNN story is excellent.

I am constantly amazed at how news people can do a story and miss the important stuff for fluff, and worse colour a story to sensationalize and steer public opinion. In this case, knowing the activity for 40 years and and the current issues, I find the author's dispassionate writing to be above par.

Sure the story is emotional for many of us, but for Joe Blow it gives all the info needed to understand what is going on.

We could only wish for more stories done like this in national and international media (same for the LaCrosse TV pieces I've seen about the Blue Stars).

Regards,

John

[BDCorno]

Drum corps has start to start thinking like a business. No business would continue to spend more and more to produce its product without knowing that it would increase revenue. If it doesn't show and ROI, you cut back.

Unfortunately, corps don't think of "return on investment" in terms of more people in the stands, they think of it in terms of the score recap.

As someone else said, the activity has done it to themselves. They don't need to spend as much money as they do except in some pursuit of an extra tenth of a point.

Drum corps could just as easily put a stop to it, but every rule change they propose adds to the cost of running a corps. The shows they put on the field have gotten to a level where they are less assessible to the average person. It's not a growth strategy or even a maintenance strategy. If I was to define it in business terms, they are becoming more niche than they have ever been.

Good points, though I don't necessarily agree with your second point re/ROI.

With all the bluster re/"entertainment" of the audience as the seemingly sole reason why DCI is struggling, why don't we look at some of the "elephants in the room"? Corps numbered in the hundreds back when DCI got started. Now we're down to less than 50. DCI crowds have always been primarily centered around families, friends and alumni of the corps competing. The more people involved, the more people became involved. As drum corps have dried up over the years (cost and rise of competitive youth sports as the main culprits, I'd surmise), so have the amount of potential customers.

IMHO, shrinkage of the activity has led to the smaller crowds, not some "lack of entertainment" from the groups themselves. I just watched the theater show last nite, and was entertained by EVERY CORPS ON THE BROADCAST. Some more than others? Sure! I shudder to think if all the corps were clones of each other (though the drills are looking pretty similar among at least 50%)...variety makes for a good show, not some "Bb" approach. It's apparent to me the "G7" have decided that the rest of the activity is a drag on their ability to grow and prosper. What they don't believe is that them helping to grow the activity...seeding new corps, sharing secrets of success and business acumen, not taking on 'title hunters' who marched with other corps, etc...is in their best interest (or less difficult to just move on). Woe to the non-G7 corps - don't look for help growing your groups from the G7. It's every man for himself! I don't think it's a nefarious plot to intentionally inflict damage to the activity, it's just business people who have decided that responsibility to their own "companies" is more important than growing their trade.

[TerriTroop]

I especially love Hoppy's comment about "loving it the way it is, but the way it is won't suvive" with absolutely NO facts o data to back up that statement aside from corps number and a rundown of expenses. Said nothing about how many of these corps raise that much or more and stay on budget from year to year without much of an issue.

The truth about having a frequently heard voice making the same statement over and over again: say it enough and some people will start to believe it and say it themselves. He's no dummy.

[GMichael1230]

What people don't get about me is I love it the way it is, I reallydo," Hopkins said. "But it's not going to survive if we don't let otherpeople in -- the next big wall is woodwind instruments."

Really George? You think the way to SAVE Drum & Bugle Corps is by allowing the use of woodwinds?

I think the rest of the world would consider that KILLING drum corps once and for all.

Hell, I stopped going to shows after you ruined the activity with electronics.

For anyone who is really interested, here is how to get Drum Corps back on track:

1) Stop with the woodwind talk. Even the most progressive DCI fans realize that would be a HUGE mistake

2) Do away with the electronics. enough is enough already. OK, we tried them, all they do is allow corps to cheat horn parts and boost weak low brass sections. How about we just teach the kids to play.

3) Reinstitute the regional organizations DCE, DCM... so corps can stay closer to home for half the summer and save on travel costs.

4) Hold regional championships in Mid-July so new Corps just getting started can run a half season and still have something to shoot for.

5) Simplify the activity, not complicate it. The simpler the activity, the less it will cost to run. Brass, Drums, Guard. Thats all you need. If you really need electronics and gizmos then what you REALLY need is a better arranger/designer.

(prime example is 1991 SCV. They did Miss Saigon and recreated the sounds of helicopters. marching troops, and others using just a creative pit. No electronics. I am sure if that show was done today it would all be done on synth by pushing a button. Explain to me how that futhers the activity)

6) Get corporate sponsorship. Every drum and brass company on the planet benefits from DCI well beyond the amount they put into it.

7) Cap the amount of money that corps can raise from membership dues. There are other ways to raise money without bleeding the members dry.

8) Get back to what the KIDS expect and want from Drum Corps, not what the adults and designers want.

Doesn't sound that difficult to me. By adding more and more junk to the activity (electronics, synth, woodwinds) all that is happening is it gets more expensive to field a corps and the gap between the haves and have nots gets wider and wider. Simplify and get back to the corps of what the activity is about and it can flourish once again.

Marry Me !!

G

[ouooga]

Driving home from the theater with my son (CT Hurricanes member this year, DCI hopeful in the future) and daughter, and my son said to me "I don't see what all the crap is about woodwinds in marching band (not Corps...). It takes 5-7 clarinets to make up the sound a trumpet can produce, and that is not even playing the trumpet loud! Woodwinds have no place on the marching field....."

And you know what? He is right.

You really think there is something intrinsically different between brass players and woodwind players?

I know plenty of woodwind players who wanted to march corps but didn't because they couldn't play their instrument.

I played clarinet. I was the loudest clarinet in my marching band, and I was embarrassed by how soft I was playing compared to any trumpet player. I wanted to march drum corps. On my first day in college, I went to the bandroom and checked out a baritone. I practiced, and I marched with two different corps.

If a woodwind wants to march drum corps, they can learn a drum corps instrument. You cannot hear woodwinds. This isn't being discriminatory. You are hearing it from the horses mouth: Woodwinds do not belong in drum corps!

2) The top Corps just hold audtions, they dont "Raid" the lower corps

3) Maybe we should just prevent kinds in lower Corps from the opportunity to march where they want

I completely agree! However, I would argue two points:

Members are still free to audition wherever they want. Would there be any benefit in the lower corps (or even all corps) to offer discounts on future years if they were under contract to march those years with that corps? "You can pay $1,500 this year and $1,500 next year, or you can pay $2,500 if you commit to both years." DCI doesn't let you march a corps if you owe money to another corps, so your options would be to pay what you owe or march with that corps.

But even with this, I have to argue that staffs are what make these top corps the top. Yes, the members are a huge factor, but it's show design and teaching that create a championship corps. The differences in design and technique are obvious between the top 12 and the rest, and I still don't understand why there's such a disconnect.

[DrinkinOuttaCups]

What people don't get about me is I love it the way it is, I reallydo," Hopkins said. "But it's not going to survive if we don't let otherpeople in -- the next big wall is woodwind instruments."

Really George? You think the way to SAVE Drum & Bugle Corps is by allowing the use of woodwinds?

I think the rest of the world would consider that KILLING drum corps once and for all.

Hell, I stopped going to shows after you ruined the activity with electronics.

For anyone who is really interested, here is how to get Drum Corps back on track:

1) Stop with the woodwind talk. Even the most progressive DCI fans realize that would be a HUGE mistake

2) Do away with the electronics. enough is enough already. OK, we tried them, all they do is allow corps to cheat horn parts and boost weak low brass sections. How about we just teach the kids to play.

3) Reinstitute the regional organizations DCE, DCM... so corps can stay closer to home for half the summer and save on travel costs.

4) Hold regional championships in Mid-July so new Corps just getting started can run a half season and still have something to shoot for.

5) Simplify the activity, not complicate it. The simpler the activity, the less it will cost to run. Brass, Drums, Guard. Thats all you need. If you really need electronics and gizmos then what you REALLY need is a better arranger/designer.

(prime example is 1991 SCV. They did Miss Saigon and recreated the sounds of helicopters. marching troops, and others using just a creative pit. No electronics. I am sure if that show was done today it would all be done on synth by pushing a button. Explain to me how that futhers the activity)

6) Get corporate sponsorship. Every drum and brass company on the planet benefits from DCI well beyond the amount they put into it.

7) Cap the amount of money that corps can raise from membership dues. There are other ways to raise money without bleeding the members dry.

8) Get back to what the KIDS expect and want from Drum Corps, not what the adults and designers want.

Doesn't sound that difficult to me. By adding more and more junk to the activity (electronics, synth, woodwinds) all that is happening is it gets more expensive to field a corps and the gap between the haves and have nots gets wider and wider. Simplify and get back to the corps of what the activity is about and it can flourish once again.

You see, you're different from the other folks who complain that drum corps should go back to how it was when THEY marched. They're all like "i wantz teh g bugles and spats and tics nd stuff," but you're different. All of your points are good (except one, which I'll elaborate on in a minute). I would be totally okay with these things happening.

The one thing I disagree with is getting rid of electronics. I don't think they should be taken away completely, but I think how they're implemented into the show needs to change drastically. Right now, you're right - they're just being used to boost bass parts and duplicate other parts, and they don't really add anything interesting to the show. I would like it if people started using electronics in a manner similar to which the Bluecoats are doing. Take the baritone solo, for instance - it's played into a mic that doesn't just make it louder - it adds a unique and interesting effect that couldn't be done acoustically. It's not just some sound effect like a baby giggle or the sound of somebody biting into an apple - it's something new and, in my opinion, kinda cool.

[Piper]

I don't know who trashed Hoppy's car but it wasn't me. I was at a DCA show that night.

[Madrid]

What people don't get about me is I love it the way it is, I reallydo," Hopkins said. "But it's not going to survive if we don't let otherpeople in -- the next big wall is woodwind instruments."

Really George? You think the way to SAVE Drum & Bugle Corps is by allowing the use of woodwinds?

I think the rest of the world would consider that KILLING drum corps once and for all.

Hell, I stopped going to shows after you ruined the activity with electronics.

For anyone who is really interested, here is how to get Drum Corps back on track:

1) Stop with the woodwind talk. Even the most progressive DCI fans realize that would be a HUGE mistake

2) Do away with the electronics. enough is enough already. OK, we tried them, all they do is allow corps to cheat horn parts and boost weak low brass sections. How about we just teach the kids to play.

3) Reinstitute the regional organizations DCE, DCM... so corps can stay closer to home for half the summer and save on travel costs.

4) Hold regional championships in Mid-July so new Corps just getting started can run a half season and still have something to shoot for.

5) Simplify the activity, not complicate it. The simpler the activity, the less it will cost to run. Brass, Drums, Guard. Thats all you need. If you really need electronics and gizmos then what you REALLY need is a better arranger/designer.

(prime example is 1991 SCV. They did Miss Saigon and recreated the sounds of helicopters. marching troops, and others using just a creative pit. No electronics. I am sure if that show was done today it would all be done on synth by pushing a button. Explain to me how that futhers the activity)

6) Get corporate sponsorship. Every drum and brass company on the planet benefits from DCI well beyond the amount they put into it.

7) Cap the amount of money that corps can raise from membership dues. There are other ways to raise money without bleeding the members dry.

8) Get back to what the KIDS expect and want from Drum Corps, not what the adults and designers want.

Doesn't sound that difficult to me. By adding more and more junk to the activity (electronics, synth, woodwinds) all that is happening is it gets more expensive to field a corps and the gap between the haves and have nots gets wider and wider. Simplify and get back to the corps of what the activity is about and it can flourish once again.

Some good points right there!!! I like # 3, 4 & 8. Especially #8. I mean seriously...

[CloudHype]

Really?! There is no way you're actually serious with this statement, implying that woodwind musicians wouldn't gain educationally from marching a season of drum corps.

Geez; I know we all love to spout ridiculous rhetoric about things we dislike (or even things we like), but if you honestly believe what I bolded above then you clearly know absolutely nothing about drum corps

Yes.