Amping the brass line

[brians]

so right to the point, should a corps get as much credit/equal credit if they are miking more than just small ensembles or soloists?  Ie... should corps who are using mikes on their entire horn line, or select individuals to enhance sound for greatest impact/blend/balance etc.... be rewarded as much as purely acoustic playing which relies more on human ability rather than a mixing board?  I contend if the answer to the later is yes, then all horns should be miked or it is simply not a level playing field. 

[Stu]

5 minutes ago, E3D said:

I was not discussing or disagreeing that point with you. Point is / was and still is - That it does not sound right and makes it difficult to determine where the people are who are actually playing music. Alt point is that how do you really know it is live sound / music after it has passed through your sound board or mixing. Could it not have been a recording mixed in?

If your credentials and edumication allows you to tell the difference between what has been recorded and what is being played live after passing through amplification and mixing then you're like the IBM Watson of music. 

Apparently you did not read my posting on page 15 concerning the very issue between sound of an orchestra from speakers vs an orchestras non amplified acoustic sound. I really do not want to insult you, but seem to be more fixated on the whistling and wall-hiding emojis than actually reading posts.

[E3D]

15 minutes ago, Stu said:

Apparently you did not read my posting on page 15 concerning the very issue between sound of an orchestra from speakers vs an orchestras non amplified acoustic sound. I really do not want to insult you, but seem to be more fixated on the whistling and wall-hiding emojis than actually reading posts.

I read it. Why you would latch onto the emojis is strange. You want us all to go out and rent an orchestra or two. So glad smart folks such as yourself are judging. Makes us poor saps who buy tickets feel like fools because we don't know any better. 

As I said up-thread instead of "adjudicating" from the box come down to where us non sound edumacted types used to be able to sit and enjoy a show, now we have some speaker in our grill and can't determine what is going on because of the mixing and amplification of sound. We really need you there to inform us on what it is we are listening to. 

 

Just for you. 

BTW - it is now up to 78 people so you need to revise that 75 your question went out to. Since no one replied to that post - After last year watching Bluecoats mid season I considered not watching any more shows. So far I still want to watch, but that has more to do with my loyalty to one corps than anything else. I have to admit that I'm not big into change. My apologies if my post about you having interest in this or not. Must have caught your nerves. Once I read your post about being a judge I can also understand your condescending tone in your posting. 

 

Edited July 18, 2017 by E3D

[E3D]

Does anyone have the DCI rules on amplification and mixing? 

[Stu]

4 minutes ago, brians said:

so right to the point, should a corps get as much credit/equal credit if they are miking more than just small ensembles or soloists?  Ie... should corps who are using mikes on their entire horn line, or select individuals to enhance sound for greatest impact/blend/balance etc.... be rewarded as much as purely acoustic playing which relies more on human ability rather than a mixing board?  I contend if the answer to the later is yes, then all horns should be miked or it is simply not a level playing field. 

There is fairness and a level playing field in subjective adjudicating as long as the critera are defined and the adudicators are consistent in applying that criteria, no matter the criteria. However, as long as there are performance variables including but not limited to performer numbers, performer age and talent differences, money spent on equipment and staff, quality of the equipment and staff, music chart differences like jazz vs classical vs rock, arranging style differences, amped vs non amped, ad infinitum, the variius design choices will influence the final scoring outcome.

[Cappybara]

15 minutes ago, E3D said:

I read it. Why you would latch onto the emojis is strange. You want us all to go out and rent an orchestra or two. So glad smart folks such as yourself are judging. Makes us poor saps who buy tickets feel like fools because we don't know any better. 

As I said up-thread instead of "adjudicating" from the box come down to where us non sound edumacted types used to be able to sit and enjoy a show, now we have some speaker in our grill and can't determine what is going on because of the mixing and amplification of sound. We really need you there to inform us on what it is we are listening to. 

 

Just for you. 

BTW - it is now up to 78 people so you need to revise that 75 your question went out to. Since no one replied to that post - After last year watching Bluecoats mid season I considered not watching any more shows. So far I still want to watch, but that has more to do with my loyalty to one corps than anything else. I have to admit that I'm not big into change. My apologies if my post about you having interest in this or not. Must have caught your nerves. Once I read your post about being a judge I can also understand your condescending tone in your posting. 

 

Maybe I'm just stupid but I'm not understanding what you two are arguing about. 

Both of you are arguing the same thing from the looks of it: there is a distinct difference between acoustical vs amplified sound coming from a speaker (no matter how high quality the speaker is)

[E3D]

2 minutes ago, Cappybara said:

Maybe I'm just stupid but I'm not understanding what you two are arguing about. 

Both of you are arguing the same thing from the looks of it: there is a distinct difference between acoustical vs amplified sound coming from a speaker (no matter how high quality the speaker is)

You are not stupid. I must have slipped up. Apologies for taking up the bandwidth. 

[Eleran]

10 minutes ago, Cappybara said:

Both of you are arguing the same thing from the looks of it: 

But one of them is live, and one is Memorex.  Can you tell the difference?

[dcibrando]

good God no... drum corps has already taken a turn in the wrong direction (imo) with the overuse of spandex and more dancing than playing and marching

 

I'm ok with most of the changes that have been made but these new "uniforms" and show designs are beginning to change the activity in a big way.  DCI is now WGI outdoors.  I think it's time for 2 different classes. 

Edited July 18, 2017 by dcibrando

[cowtown]

I’m still not convinced the rules do allow the amping of the entire horn line. When they passed mic-ed brass it was limited to 12 horn players and I don’t recall any update being passed saying otherwise and no one has provided info on the rules change. I suspect that’s why SCV settled on 12 horns mic-ed to stay with in the rules and Bloo and Regiment are getting a pass and not following the rules. I did notice SCV's small ensemble on the snake disc and being staged for parts but I didn’t follow them the entire show. It still doesn't mean it was good and they did blow musical effect

But ignoring the entire structural debate of the rules, it wasn’t good. It wasn’t done well. Due to amp placement and the nature of sound, it will never be done well. You are sacrificing the sound in parts of the stands regardless so should they lower the price of the tickets in the amp zones, like they do for view obstructed tickets?  It’s getting more and more pointless to go to a live show. I also feel the music education value is dropping. If anything goes, why not record the entire show with professionals, even the same professionals for all shows then do a milli vanilli, brass-synch by blasting the pre-recorded track through the amps? How does the rest of the horn line feel playing under the featured players, are they cool as a dancing, back up band? Maybe they are, I dunno. One of the unique features of drum corps was the sound of the large horn lines and now they are going the way of the dinosaurs, gone