Grandpa Posted August 16, 2012 Share Posted August 16, 2012 I'm guessing that if this merger happens, it'll mean the formerly open class corps will get paid, but there will be a new system of differential payments so that Blue Saints don't get the same $$$ as Blue Devils. Which is why this will probably not fly. There's only so much apprearence money to go around. For the OC corps to get a piece of it means a little less in the pockets of the WC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
13strokeroll Posted August 16, 2012 Share Posted August 16, 2012 So there has to be a commitment by the 8 to support and incubate the others? Help grow their own competition? Who are we kidding? 6 corps were duking it out for 11 and 12. Exciting yes, a threat to the 8, no. How many members of those 6 are going to try their luck and audition up? 50%? 60%? They aren't breeding their competition, they're breeding their future members. The best way to do so is to have experienced auditionees at the highest possible level. I don't see the new model providing that, as otherwise appealing it may be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flammaster Posted August 16, 2012 Share Posted August 16, 2012 Trickle Down! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted August 16, 2012 Share Posted August 16, 2012 Who says a return to the 70's is a bad thing? That's exactly what this is, after all! And oddly enough, having taught in what used to be Div 3 - I'm not sure of how I feel about it. I agree with the point of giving the smaller corps something realistic to strive for. When I was teaching and judging in the Garden State Circuit...one season in the late 70's the corps got on a kick to have the judges use the concept of "National Linear" in setting our tolerance...we judged every corps based on how they stack up to the best we had ever seen...imagine scoring a bunch of 9-12 year old beginners using the same standards that we'd use judging the Blue Devils or Bridgemen. Needless to say...that experiment quickly disappeared rather early on...we got the message to go back to GSC-linear tolerance. Remembering that experience makes me wonder about scoring everybody on the same scale. I can see pluses and minuses to both approaches. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted August 16, 2012 Share Posted August 16, 2012 When I was teaching and judging in the Garden State Circuit...one season in the late 70's the corps got on a kick to have the judges use the concept of "National Linear" in setting our tolerance...we judged every corps based on how they stack up to the best we had ever seen...imagine scoring a bunch of 9-12 year old beginners using the same standards that we'd use judging the Blue Devils or Bridgemen. Needless to say...that experiment quickly disappeared rather early on...we got the message to go back to GSC-linear tolerance. Remembering that experience makes me wonder about scoring everybody on the same scale. I can see pluses and minuses to both approaches. FINALLY!!!!! someone said it...lol.Ive been waiting for someone to say this...I wonder how many OC corps of today are going to be ok on the WC sheets busting butt all summer ,yes going up against the best of the best ( which is cool ) BUT how many may like NEVER hitting a 70...... thats not only more than possible but probabal. there just so many #s to work with Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soccerguy315 Posted August 16, 2012 Share Posted August 16, 2012 I like the system as it works now. Leave World Class as World Class, keep Open Class as it is, and perhaps create a Class B level I propose we call "Class B" something along the lines of... "Division III" 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Posted August 16, 2012 Share Posted August 16, 2012 When I was teaching and judging in the Garden State Circuit...one season in the late 70's the corps got on a kick to have the judges use the concept of "National Linear" in setting our tolerance...we judged every corps based on how they stack up to the best we had ever seen...imagine scoring a bunch of 9-12 year old beginners using the same standards that we'd use judging the Blue Devils or Bridgemen. Needless to say...that experiment quickly disappeared rather early on...we got the message to go back to GSC-linear tolerance. Remembering that experience makes me wonder about scoring everybody on the same scale. I can see pluses and minuses to both approaches. The other side of the coin (literally) is the potential for appearance money for OC level corps. Assuming that could be negotiated, I most definitely like the idea. The little guys could use some help. Survival trumps scoring considerations, IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted August 16, 2012 Share Posted August 16, 2012 (edited) The other side of the coin (literally) is the potential for appearance money for OC level corps. Assuming that could be negotiated, I most definitely like the idea. The little guys could use some help. Survival trumps scoring considerations, IMHO. im sure it would be a situation that to go to a show costs more than they would be getting....financially would it help if they got some $..sure...but as someone who stands in front of many kids MANY all summer long survial also means some sort of success...Surf had a different kind of success this summer and it was great but your not going to have 10 of them out there. When a corps shows no progression ( within the competition ) add on top sleeping on floors all summer, cramped buses, staff yapping at you and your mistakes all summer,then going to a show after hours and houra of praftice and going up 1 tenth or even going down depending on show dynamics, It can be very hard to keep someone motivated. I get ya totally and agree BUT there is certainly 2 sides to that coin I would think if DCI ever considers this it will only be for money reasons. Of course they will spell out a novel saying how it will benefit a corps BUT my thought is many many OC performances do not bring in alot of gate revenue. At least I assume when you see the tiny numbers. Even at championships, how cost effective is it for the OC show. having everyone together could cut back on some of that.....I dont think OC corps would see more people though. like in the past, people will just show up later to a show.. I know it sucks BUT what can I tell ya. Edited August 16, 2012 by GUARDLING Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonW Posted August 16, 2012 Share Posted August 16, 2012 On the surface this does appear to be a real good idea, more in-depth information is undeniably required. I haven't yet figured out how to word my thoughts on this, but one question is at the forefront. One (beneficial?) aspect of the tic system was that a corps of 60 actually could beat a corps of 128. Under the current system/sheets, would a similar event be allowed to happen? Also curious about the payouts, unlikely any corps below 15th place would collect. Man, I hope I am wrong, but this feels like the perfect way to phase-out what some have deemed those "useless, lesser ranking corps that have no place in 'the big picture'". Make it so there is simply no way they can compete. Hmmm, deja vu? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted August 16, 2012 Share Posted August 16, 2012 On the surface this does appear to be a real good idea, more in-depth information is undeniably required. I haven't yet figured out how to word my thoughts on this, but one question is at the forefront. One (beneficial?) aspect of the tic system was that a corps of 60 actually could beat a corps of 128. Under the current system/sheets, would a similar event be allowed to happen? Also curious about the payouts, unlikely any corps below 15th place would collect. Man, I hope I am wrong, but this feels like the perfect way to phase-out what some have deemed those "useless, lesser ranking corps that have no place in 'the big picture'". Make it so there is simply no way they can compete. Hmmm, deja vu? your last sentence could very well be true. Of course as I said at 1st it will be presented as a great thing for the lower corps and focus on what they may THINK they are getting...As far as the tic system , the only reason anyone could win anytime was that it was a free for all. TOTALLY subjective, worse than now.....look back on some scores from BITD ( I was shocked when I did recently ( which I usually never look back..lol ) a corps I had marched in with an 84 at one show and the next day a 76...and that had nothing to do with better corps one day or another......what a hot mess...lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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