George Dixon Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 Look. I love Appalachian Spring. SCV 2009 is one of my favorite shows. I also am a very strong supporter of narration as long as it's done tastefully. It was down tastefully by Crown last year. It's being down tastefully by Crown even this year. And it's being done pretty #### well by the Cadets this year. So let me say that both the whole Americana aspect nor the narration are the turn offs for me about this show/ What IS turning me off the way it's being executed. The best way for me to describe this show is robotic. None of the members lived through any of the history that they are trying to express in the form of music. They have no emotional connection and it shows in their playing and marching. They're clean. #### clean. They could not be executing higher. But I feel absolutely no emotion from their hornline and percussion. It's like a 150 member robot army is performing a marching show. There's no exciting moments at all. Id much rather listen to the Blue Knights play their show. Now THAT is emotion. And it was narration too, imagine that. I agree to a very large extent. I don't put the blame on the performers as much as the design itself. If you watch the guard for example they are "emoting" with the best of them. The design is just slow... A few sections of velocity would do wonders... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Dixon Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 No. Wish I had the opportunity to see them all live this year. Wish I was in Atlanta right now. It is hard to believe it would make THAT much difference to what I am speaking of though. And the audiences that are seeing it live don't seem to be exactly eating it up so.... Look, if the show is connecting with some people emotionally I think that is great. The more the better for DCI. I would certainly never tell them they are wrong. Different people connect with different things. But suffice it to say I was relieved to hear someone else say what I was feeling. Or not feeling, as the case may be. Gotcha. I do think it comes across better in person due to the staging - they use the whole field and you have solos and features coming at you from various directions. Some of THAT gets lost online. I know you've been watching corps a long time though so I'm sure you take some of that into account. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjeffeory Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 I agree to a very large extent. I don't put the blame on the performers as much as the design itself. If you watch the guard for example they are "emoting" with the best of them. The design is just slow... A few sections of velocity would do wonders... OMG, THIS. These guys and gals are the masters of velocity. They should have some more of it in their show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Dixon Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 Not sure how that's relevant. Many corps are able to convey emotion over video just fine. Ultimately people who want to listen to this show will listen to a recording, not see it live. For me the type of staging can make online a lot different than in person for certain shows. Often BD comes across MUCH better in person than online - this year it comes across pretty well online. Cadets program is staged so full-field that it doesn't seem as effective online - with solos & various features & small group ensembles coming at you from various directions live. That is really lost on FN. That said - I saw them 3 times live so far - once the performance was VERY flat and the audience seemed bored, so there's also a bit of "bad design" at play here regardless of online or live. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris ncsu Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 Ehhhh, the "looking robotic" part -- The Cadets are always going to look that way, it's the way they march and how limited they are in the amount of rolling around that's possible, if you even consider that to be emotive. The guard are the actors here -- they emote the hell out of this show, it seems like there's always a dance troop happening, and wonderful silk work. It's a strange comment, to me, to say that the corps can't connect to the show because they weren't alive in 1862, 1942, or 1962 -- then let's just throw out everything Troopers or Regiment ever do. So, I'm not sure what else the members are supposed to do. Have a Civil War battle (2011)? Recreate Pearl Harbor (ditched 2012 idea)? Do a soup line (BD 2009, or so they say)? Launch to the moon (that's my take on what the drumline does as App Spring ramps up)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cappybara Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 Ehhhh, the "looking robotic" part -- The Cadets are always going to look that way, it's the way they march and how limited they are in the amount of rolling around that's possible, if you even consider that to be emotive. The guard are the actors here -- they emote the hell out of this show, it seems like there's always a dance troop happening, and wonderful silk work. It's a strange comment, to me, to say that the corps can't connect to the show because they weren't alive in 1862, 1942, or 1962 -- then let's just throw out everything Troopers or Regiment ever do. So, I'm not sure what else the members are supposed to do. Have a Civil War battle (2011)? Recreate Pearl Harbor (ditched 2012 idea)? Do a soup line (BD 2009, or so they say)? Launch to the moon (that's my take on what the drumline does as App Spring ramps up)? Well if the corps is connecting to their music, they're certainly not showing it through their playing. That's my overall point. Also I disagree about Cadets always looking robotic. There was wayyyy more emotion last year and in 2011 from the Cadets than this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skevinp Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 Ehhhh, the "looking robotic" part -- The Cadets are always going to look that way, it's the way they march and how limited they are in the amount of rolling around that's possible, if you even consider that to be emotive. The guard are the actors here -- they emote the hell out of this show, it seems like there's always a dance troop happening, and wonderful silk work. It's a strange comment, to me, to say that the corps can't connect to the show because they weren't alive in 1862, 1942, or 1962 -- then let's just throw out everything Troopers or Regiment ever do. So, I'm not sure what else the members are supposed to do. Have a Civil War battle (2011)? Recreate Pearl Harbor (ditched 2012 idea)? Do a soup line (BD 2009, or so they say)? Launch to the moon (that's my take on what the drumline does as App Spring ramps up)? To me it is mostly about not feeling any emotion from their performance of the music. Whether that is arrangement, direction or performance style I couldn't say. I know it is not the composer, though, because I have connected emotionally with much of this music before, including in other Cadets shows. I'm not trying to convince anyone who likes it that they shouldn't, just trying to explain why I and maybe some others are not reacting all that positively. So maybe they won't all be presumed to be Cadets haters, America haters, and so forth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris ncsu Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 Which is interesting, because I think they are. I mean, to the extent emotion can come through from an ensemble of people playing wind instruments on a football field in perfect timing. What you might be talking about, which again is the theme here in most of the comments on the show, is what you perceive as a lack of shape to the show, and/or a lack of velocity and body movement from them. Because that's what, in my opinion, separates this show from 2011. 2011 was way moody, had a 3 minute corps battle, always the dueling good and bad. That's what it was. The show this year is not that. 2013 was also dark, it hit you in the gut musically. That's not what this year's show is, either. I, too, would usually prefer a darker show to a lighter show -- either dark material, or a darker sound and mood. It doesn't mean Phantom Regiment 1996 or 2008 was more or less emotional than Cadets 1998 or 2005. Whether there is emotion behind those mouthpieces and sticks, well that's up to you to perceive. We all know it's there, it's there in every corps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cappybara Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 Which is interesting, because I think they are. I mean, to the extent emotion can come through from an ensemble of people playing wind instruments on a football field in perfect timing. What you might be talking about, which again is the theme here in most of the comments on the show, is what you perceive as a lack of shape to the show, and/or a lack of velocity and body movement from them. Because that's what, in my opinion, separates this show from 2011. 2011 was way moody, had a 3 minute corps battle, always the dueling good and bad. That's what it was. The show this year is not that. 2013 was also dark, it hit you in the gut musically. That's not what this year's show is, either. I, too, would usually prefer a darker show to a lighter show -- either dark material, or a darker sound and mood. It doesn't mean Phantom Regiment 1996 or 2008 was more or less emotional than Cadets 1998 or 2005. Whether there is emotion behind those mouthpieces and sticks, well that's up to you to perceive. We all know it's there, it's there in every corps. Maybe you aren't trying to do this but I'd appreciate you not trying to put words in my mouth. I know what I'm thinking or not thinking. I'm not hearing any emotion from that hornline. My issue isn't the music itself or the theme. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris ncsu Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 Not at all, just trying to understand and figure out what the members might do to communicate more emotion -- thus my pondering out loud of what it means to you to hear emotion from a hornline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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