Fran Haring Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Regarding what's going on with Crown this season: Some years.... stuff happens. My years with DCA's Sunrisers... we won the DCA title my first two seasons there (1977-78)... finished third in 1979... and then dropped to 6th in 1980. Various factors led to that drop... including the retirement of some of the corps veterans who had helped build Sun from a lower-echelon corps in the early 1970s into a champion. In other words, membership turnover. Plus... quite frankly... our show in 1980, with a couple of exceptions, went absolutely nowhere. LOL. Not our best programming effort, for sure. But we didn't pack it in. Rebounded to finish 2nd in 1981, and then another championship win in 1982, my last season. Another title in '83, two more in '87 and '88. I guess my point is.... it's best to keep working hard and staying as positive as possible during the "down" years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slingerland Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Apart from that period of time... I'm not sure that drumcorps fans had the Cavaliers in mind as a potential champion any more than SCV (kinda like today)... or Phantom (who by then had finally won after many close seconds). From 1986 through 2011, Cavaliers' average placement was 2.69 at Finals, vs 2.4 for Cadets over the same time frame. Sounds like they were pretty competitive for a much longer period than just 2000 through 2006. If last year's champion is looking at a potential 5th this year (they are), and Rosemont ends up within a few tenths of them come Indy (very possible), it's going to be hard to argue that Cavaliers are not still considered a premiere destination for the top level design and marching talent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfirwin3 Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Your assumption that I coined the DCI Royal Family " Cadevaliers " from " the limited time horizon scope of 2000-2006 " is an erroneous one. The Cadevaliers period of time I utilize is actually from 1976 all the way through to today... and without interruption. Since 1976, over 80% of the DCI Titles have been won by the Cadevaliers. More telling, is that only once since 1976 have the Cadevaliers not returned to the Throne after a 1 year absence due to an interloper taking the Throne for 1 year. 2014 will be no different as I use this extended history as my guide. I also predict that without a reasonable and sensible transfer poicy adopted by DCI ( that few have an appetite for currently ) that the Cadevaliers will actually increase their Royal Family hold on the DCI Throne from its current over 80% since 1976, to approx. 95% over the next 35 years in my long range placement predictions. But... only time will tell if I'm right on this, or not. You are adding a name that currently has no championship relevance (hasn't for a few years) to your concoction to increase the percentage of wins. Why not add SCV to your name and get to 95% sooner? Your statements have an arbitrary basis (starting in 1976 and including 3 drumcorps). You set an exclusive premise in order to validate an arbitrary point. In that line of thinking... 90% of DCI titles have been won since the beginning (not the arbitrary start date of 1976, when the devils fist won... to support your arbitrary point) by the Cadevalierguard. Fuzzy math = fuzzy points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfirwin3 Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 You are adding a name that currently has no championship relevance (hasn't for a few years) to your concoction to increase the percentage of wins. Why not add SCV to your name and get to 95% sooner? Your statements have an arbitrary basis (starting in 1976 and including 3 drumcorps). You set an exclusive premise in order to validate an arbitrary point. In that line of thinking... 90% of DCI titles have been won since the beginning (not the arbitrary start date of 1976, when the devils fist won... to support your arbitrary point) by the Cadevalierguard. Fuzzy math = fuzzy points. Some of you, for some reason, think that I am defaming the Cavalier organization. Which I have not done. I AM pointing out that the point that is being made over and over and over and over again with this "Cadevalier" thing is silly and designed in a particular way, through particular exclusions, based on a bias (perhaps fan influence) of one short era, to be true. The Cavaliers are a great organization... but this model is riding heavily on 2 drumcorps rather than 3 and is excluding one (SCV) with an arbitrary start of 1976 (in order to be more true). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quietcity Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 While this SOUNDS nice and all, the fact of the matter is, If the marchers in Crown went there primarily for the " forging of life long friendships and memories", etc, and that sort of thing, they could just as easily gotten THAT from just about ANY Corps. If they went to Crown primarily for these reasons, then naturally they are " still having a hell of a time " just as you said. On the other hand, if they left another Corps this past offseason, to primarily have a chance of getting a ring with Crown, then naturally one would assume that the experience of this season so far has been a huge disappointment for them. Ah, Brasso, my little ray of sunshine. Life is about the pursuit of the ring, not necessarily the having of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 (edited) You are adding a name that currently has no championship relevance (hasn't for a few years) to your concoction to increase the percentage of wins. Why not add SCV to your name and get to 95% sooner? Fuzzy math = fuzzy points. I don't include SCV in the math calculation" from 1976 to today", as I would not only not arrive at " 95% sooner, we would not even reach the " 80% or more" threshold. Thats why I didn't opt to use YOUR " fuzzy math ". I used my own math calculations to coin my phrase, " The Cadevaliers ", and the percentages of wins since 1976. Your demand now for me to substitute SCV for the Cavaliers, would not arrive at all in the " over 80% " calculation, ( not even close ) thus we could not state this as a fact... and thus, why I did not utilize SCV instead of the Cavaliers. Furthermore, SCV has only won 1 DCI Title now in the last 25 years ( since 1990 ). I don't envision this Calif. Corps subplanting the other Calif Corps at the top any time soon either. They are destined for 2nd fiddle to BD for the next 25 years too, imo. Edited July 24, 2014 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Ah, Brasso, my little ray of sunshine. Life is about the pursuit of the ring, not necessarily the having of it. I never stated otherwise. I even acknowledged above that there are multiple possible reasons for somebody marching Crown this year ( including, but by no means limited to, " the ring chasers " ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c.l. Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 I just prefer to say what it is: Blue Devils. If you want a medal, 90% of the time it works every time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c.l. Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 I just prefer to say what it is: Blue Devils. If you want a medal, 90% of the time it works every time. And I don't mean to sound like I'm alluding to ring chasers, which I'm not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caliswift Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 (edited) Corps who rose up fast eventually disappear, or in the unique case of Star of Indiana, decide to throw in the towel as a Corps, and do something else. We have seen so many Corps like Crown come and go that it is almost predictable the fate that eventually takes hold. Perhaps Crown won't eventually suffer such future fate, but I would not bet on it. Jesus dude, hate Crown much? Are you seriously suggesting the corps that won last year is not a "safe bet" to stay in existence? In the history of DCI one champion folded and one went a direction that wasn't drum corps. Crown is the corps that is winning the brass caption for their current season which represents the largest portion of the corps. While I agree Crown rose fast in comparison to most corps but they started in 90, won division II in 93, made finals for the first time in 95, medaled for the first time in 2009 and won in 2013. It's nothing like Star's immediate emergence on the scene supported by an amazing financial backing or the series of amazing mishaps that happened to the Kingsman. Crown is fine. Show design is clearly not meeting the judges expectations. I respect that they are trying new things whether or not I actually like it. Their brass line is still setting the standard. More than anything I respect what they are teaching the kids. Speaking of out of this world....fear is the mind-killer. Edited July 24, 2014 by caliswift 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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