Where is DCI?

[N.E. Brigand]

I didn't live through the 60s or 70s, but I've watched enough tape to at least understand and appreciate it. However, If you watch several corps in a row arc it up as part of their show (ballads), i think it loses its impact. Of course, as much as seeing everyone arc up, is as lame as seeing every corps squat and twist bend their legs at a hold. Its now predictable. We used to know there was a ballad coming up, look, here comes that arc. We now know a hold is coming up... oh look... there's the dog squat, there's that dancy fancy soft shoe. Yep, we've seen every corps use the same dozen or so body moves you can do with a horn in your hand at this point. Its no longer new, or creative.

But each has their place. Old school stuff still had great lines being played and great groups doing amazing things with only a valve or two, as well as driving home that the activity is about precision. New school stuff still has great lines and arranging, but made this an activity to watch as well as listen to.

Good post. Every era has its tropes, which often aren't noticed by even the most perceptive observers at the time.

On the other hand, sometimes observers looking into the past fail to realize that what they see as tired cliches might have seemed to people then as being the essence of the activity at the time, and that if we could travel back in time to make our case, we might find ourselves roundly defeated by arguments that never even occurred to us.

I am reminded of something C.S. Lewis wrote in The Discarded Image, his study of the underlying assumptions of Medieval literature. Lewis notes how often ancient writers, even great ones, recycled older stories.

"I doubt if they would have understood our demand for originality, or valued those works in their own age which were original any the more on that account. If you had asked Layamon or Chaucer, 'Why do you not make up a brand-new story of your own?', I think they might have replied (in effect), 'Surely we are not yet reduced to that?' Spin something out of one's own head when the world teems with so many noble deeds, wholesome examples, pitiful tragedies, strange adventures and merry jests which have never yet been set forth quite so well as they deserve? The originality which we regard as a sign of wealth might have seemed to them a confession of poverty."

[UKSuperman]

Is it better to be a stick in the mud or a leaf in the wind?

Probably neither.

A leaf in the wind sees and hears more than a stick in the mud.

A stick in the mud eventually gets swallowed up.

Edited July 19, 2016 by UKSuperman

[cixelsyd]

I'm sorry, but this is a idiotic post. DCI groups will no longer be "Drum Corps"?

Unless they add woodwinds in, it'll still be Drum Corps.

That is exactly what I was saying. When the woodwinds are added, it will no longer be drum corps.

Edited July 19, 2016 by cixelsyd

[UKSuperman]

That is exactly what I was saying. When the woodwinds are added, it will no longer be drum corps.

Oh, okay. Lol. Pretty sure they won't be thanks to soundsport. I'm a former woodwind player, so I believe that they should be given the same opportunity, but I don't think it should be in the DCI field. Used to, but that thinking has changed. Lol.

[garfield]

Maybe the inaccuracy is in your reading. I never said that the activity is "surviving on the industry", but rather, that their direction is driven by the marching band industry.

Both.

I am aware that this may vary from district to disctrict (which is why I said "largely subsidized", not wholly). But every district I am familiar with has this thing called a "budget", which is based on our tax dollars. The budget includes funds for maintaining the facilities the band uses, as well as salary for the band director(s) and some money for instrument acquisition, repair and replacement. The desires of the band often exceed the budget, which is where booster clubs, fundraisers and donations often develop.

In the beginning, they were adult aged groups like the drum corps of their day.

Surprising. You usually have a quick intuition for business.

I suspect you already know the answers to your barrage of questions, nuanced as they are. The hundreds of corps were evidently not a "good customer base for the industry", as even 500 corps would not make a market of comparable size to that of the tens of thousands of school music programs. However, they were a decent market that several manufacturers happily served. Then one day, there were only 100 instead of 500, and only two manufacturers serving them. Fear of where that trend was headed was the primary public argument in favor of the "any-key brass" rule change.

Yes, today the heightened interest manufacturers take in the "drum corps" activity is not to fight each other over less than 1% of their product sales. It is about having your brand name all over the most esteemed, most traveled, most watched ensembles in the business.

The designer/instructor/judge/band diirector/product endorser community.

Over time, yes. If your company made trombones, would it never have occurred to you to suggest their addition in DCI to whomever might listen? And once they were approved, would it never have occurred to you to suggest to top corps that they feature an octet of them instead of just one? Or better yet, a full section of them in the drill?

No - today I am wearing my marketing hat.

Utter BS. Here's your base contention: Drum corps...has shrunk...to be more of a showroom...than anything else. Am I right? Those are your words. Is that what you meant in the financial sense? If it is, I still call BS.

And then you contend that the tour is "swimming" in industry sponsorship dollars. Where are your stats? Mine are in the 990's of the corps and of DCI and I say BS, you're wrong. In fact, I've heard from inside DCI that they have a terrible time attracting sponsors of any size or contribution. Look for line items that show "equipment sales" and pay attention to the numbers shown. They're puny when compared to the whole budget.

Then you contend that show design is an exercise in instrument placement? Oh come on, you're usually not so pedantic. Sponsors directing product placement like cigarette ads? Give me a break. Of course instrument contributors want their horns played on the field - why else would they contribute them? But they direct design and placement to showcase them like cigarettes? OMG, please stop. Drum and drum head manufacturers have had their wares plastered on equipment since the dawn of the activity. It's nothing new and not the result of some "precipitous decline" of the activity. I suppose you'll suggest that bass drummers march sideways so that the REMO logo can be seen from the stands?

I don't deny that the sheer dollars spent by scholastic band programs dwarfs drum corps budgets. Or that drum corps sell through to band programs.

"Stadiums awash in manufacturer banners"? Pft. The statement doesn't even reach credulity, let alone credibility.

Maybe you really should put your tin foil hat on because you make a better case wearing it than you do wearing your marketing hat.

IMO, of course.

Edited July 20, 2016 by garfield

[Fran Haring]

There is little if any interest in the bulk of the DCI corps themselves to add WW. As much as I am the pro-WW guy here, I just don't see it happening any time soon.

Well.... I like Wildwood, too.

[garfield]

Leaving aside the snark and pointless arguments about ancient history, I thought cixelsyd's post had the following interesting propositions:

1. the annual $$ spent (mostly by schools) on instruments/equipment/uniforms is much larger than the $20M budgets of DCI + members

2. the manufacturers sponsor DCI, member corps, individual instructors, etc. as a "showroom" for their products. they naturally prefer that those sponsored showcase as many products as possible.

3. there are a small number of people who largely set the direction of DCI. they are accurately described by cixelsyd's phrase "overlapping interests in DCI, WGI, marching band circuits, scholastic teaching jobs and industry sales/endorsement positions".

4. those people are influenced by the manufacturers who sponsor them. they have changed DCI rules in ways that allow more sponsor products to be showcased, with 2016 The Year Of The Trombone as the current example.

Which ones do you disagree with?

I disagree that my contention that DCI founders couldn't imagine the dollars in today's drum corps became a discussion that drum corps are essentially tools for "the industry" to sell products.

For the record:

1. Agree

2. Nope. A manufacturer offers a discount on instruments in order to keep its name in front of the purchasing scholastic public. If a sponsor wants its bones "showcased", they have to be willing to make little or no money on the "sale" to the corps. Corps aren't stupid dupes in this relationship.

3. Nope. There are a small number of corps and there are more corps designers than there are corps. "Small" is relative. There are thousands of WGI, WGIWinds, marching band directors, and scholastic teaching positions and each one of them influences the direction of DCI.

4. Yes, then No if the connotation is that rules were changed with a hat-tip promise to the manufacturers. DCI approves trombones and trombone-makers rejoice. That doesn't connote some complicity or "take" on the part of drivers of DCI.

Woodwinds won't be implemented on the drum corps marching field during my lifetime, IMO.

[garfield]

That is exactly what I was saying. When the woodwinds are added, it will no longer be drum corps.

Gee, where have we heard that before?

Valves

mallet percussion

two valves

tympani and accessory percussion

grounding percussion

the pit

Bf

electronics

...

You've seen all of these discussions and you've seen these changes. But woodwinds makes it no longer drum corps? Maybe it's just your line in the sand...

OK

[Hook'emCavies]

I do like the original posters courage to post his or hers feelings on the direction of DCI. Personally, I like the 80s-2000s the most. But I can't do anything about it. I just want to sit in the stadium this Friday, get my ears blown off, and enjoy each program. I recommend enjkying what you have. Trust me, it is a lot easier to enjoy.

[N.E. Brigand]

Gee, where have we heard that before?

Valves

mallet percussion

two valves

tympani and accessory percussion

grounding percussion

the pit

Bf

electronics

...

You've seen all of these discussions and you've seen these changes. But woodwinds makes it no longer drum corps? Maybe it's just your line in the sand...

OK

Last fall, in a discussion here of marching bands, I suggested that a marching band that never moved would no longer be a "marching band".

You seemed to agree.

Similarly, there must be some way by which you define "drum corps", and separate drum corps from other things. So you too have lines in the sand, even if no corps has yet approached them.