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2019 Madison Scouts!

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19 hours ago, HockeyDad said:

This is a demonstration of how ineffective, across the spectrum of business, boards of directors are. Seriously. The CEO or in the case of DCI, the executive director, puts their buddies on the BOD. The BOD does nothing but serve as a rubber stamp for the CEO. They all pay themselves ridiculously, then look around with self-satisfaction and head for the bar. Short of committing felonies or being accused of sexual assault, Petersen and Komnick can pretty much stay in their gigs as long as they want. The chicken crap BOD will take no action unless there is absolutely no alternative to doing so. It’s evident competitive success is not a factor in their continued employment. 

DBC BoD's get paid???  In what galaxy...

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1 hour ago, xandandl said:

DBC BoD's get paid???  In what galaxy...

Though poorly worded, I think he's referring to the Executive Director and Director setting it up that way...they appoint their

rubber stamp BODs, pay themselves ridiculously, and then pat themselves on the back.....and can stay in their positions as long as they want.

I don't think he was trying to suggest that the BODs pay themselves or get paid.

At any rate,.....Go Scouts!!

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2 hours ago, xandandl said:

DBC BoD's get paid???  In what galaxy...

I love you and all that, but did you even read the post?  I’m talking about American business in general then cited a few specific corps. 

Edited by HockeyDad

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I just watched 1982, 1999, 2005, and 2015. I am a corps history buff, love old and new. I am just sick about what has happened to the corps. I usually would stay as far on the optimism side of things as possible, but just can't in regards to the past several seasons and what has happened this off season. While I wish all the best to the members and hope they have the best summer in all regards possible, it saddens me that such cannot be the case competitively. Next year (2020), or in two years can the corps survive yet a third overhaul, rebirth, survival after the storm which will require ignoring many alumni and their wants? Such gets harder and harder in drum corps as time passes- yes, Spirit, Troopers, Boston, Blue Stars, not to mention all those we have lost that did not survive a first, second, much less third revival. Three things have ended all drum corps: money, administration, and alumni. Though sorry to offend, it must be said that the alumni will have the most blame to carry on this one. There are many reasons alumni become so toxic. I think Madison the most toxic of all time and largely because once they found themselves slipping in rankings in the late 90s and early 2000s, they looked outwardly and not inwardly for blame and excuses. That decade of members were too often told the system was failing them and many of them bought it and still do. 

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1 hour ago, tigger2 said:

I just watched 1982, 1999, 2005, and 2015. I am a corps history buff, love old and new. I am just sick about what has happened to the corps. I usually would stay as far on the optimism side of things as possible, but just can't in regards to the past several seasons and what has happened this off season. While I wish all the best to the members and hope they have the best summer in all regards possible, it saddens me that such cannot be the case competitively. Next year (2020), or in two years can the corps survive yet a third overhaul, rebirth, survival after the storm which will require ignoring many alumni and their wants? Such gets harder and harder in drum corps as time passes- yes, Spirit, Troopers, Boston, Blue Stars, not to mention all those we have lost that did not survive a first, second, much less third revival. Three things have ended all drum corps: money, administration, and alumni. Though sorry to offend, it must be said that the alumni will have the most blame to carry on this one. There are many reasons alumni become so toxic. I think Madison the most toxic of all time and largely because once they found themselves slipping in rankings in the late 90s and early 2000s, they looked outwardly and not inwardly for blame and excuses. That decade of members were too often told the system was failing them and many of them bought it and still do. 

Yep. The outward vs inward looking is spot on. But it goes back to the 80s. Stewart constantly said things like "DCI is a cancer and we are the only healthy cell in the body"

And the "Judges are out to get us"...or "Chops never forgets" (Referring to the late Gary Czapinski and how he supposedly had an axe to grind against Madison for being fired)....constantly

blaming everything on the outside and not looking in the mirror.....or constantly looking back to the glory days and revive them instead of looking forward.

 But with all that said, I'm not writing them off

for this season since we haven't seen or heard anything yet. 

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On 5/15/2019 at 3:05 PM, cixelsyd said:

It sounds like you just ripped current design staff to shreds because they dare go with bland uniforms, few props, aiming to impress with loud showmanship rather than complicated themes... then you mourned the loss of Jim Mason, who had the corps with bland uniforms, few props, aiming to impress with loud showmanship rather than complicated themes.  Am I reading this correctly? 

Well, not quite. You have to remember the Mason era is long gone. The activity has evolved considerably since then. Relative to other corps during his tenure, Mason did have the corps on a positive trajectory. His shows were also for the most part well designed. Personally, I think the one thing Scouts shows lacked during the Mason era was the demand/content necessary to catch corps ahead of them, rather than the corps behind them catching them. Still, that was a good period for the Scouts in terms of show design, and somewhat competitively. I firmly believe the 2015 results were a Mason hangover, and were Mason still with the corps they would be placing considerably higher than 16th.

The problem with the current leadership of the Scouts is that they just are way in over their heads. They are lost. They have no idea what they are doing. 2016 was an entertaining show that had many problems, but it was still entertaining. In 2017, in reaction to missing finals the year before, the design team did a complete 180. Not only did the corps lose their identity with a completely boring show musically and visually, but the competitive gains were so marginal that the risk didn't pay off. The show was not well designed enough for that risk to pay off. In 2018, it seems we had another reaction and the show that came out of it was so ridiculous. Sadly, I was honestly so embarrassed for the membership last year. Had I been given that show to perform I would want to quit. I commend the membership for sticking it out (brotherhood) because it must have been really hard to not walk away.

A big difference between Mason and Chris/Dan is Mason knew what he was doing, Chris/Dan are so clueless that it's laughable. I'm sorry, but you are a complete idiot if you are presented with that ridiculous prop, that utterly laughable narration, those uniforms, that musical design and that visual design and think it's ok. It's not. Far from it. It was also a complete waste to have the female player last year. She obviously is tremendously talented, but it was a huge waste. She was literally given nothing interesting to do or play, and that dress she wore was so dull. Last year's show was a complete and total failure on every single level. They were lucky they weren't beat by SCV Cadets and BDB. It's fortunate for them that those two corps are sitting out finals this year.

I have no faith in 2019. I think it's going to get worse and worse. Really - who would want to march? Why would anyone? Answer: because you need to train to audition for BD, Bluecoats, or Blue Stars. Scouts are turning into a feeder corps, if they haven't fully turned into one already.

Edited by queenanne_1536
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21 hours ago, Nine White Russians said:

Yep. The outward vs inward looking is spot on. But it goes back to the 80s. Stewart constantly said things like "DCI is a cancer and we are the only healthy cell in the body"

And the "Judges are out to get us"...or "Chops never forgets" (Referring to the late Gary Czapinski and how he supposedly had an axe to grind against Madison for being fired)....constantly

blaming everything on the outside and not looking in the mirror.....or constantly looking back to the glory days and revive them instead of looking forward.

 But with all that said, I'm not writing them off

for this season since we haven't seen or heard anything yet. 

Exactly this. 

I too used to the think the Scouts were screwed all the time. I was wrong. Scott Stewart was wrong. They were never screwed. Of course, there are years were perhaps they could have placed a spot or two higher (or lower) and I wouldn't have argued otherwise. When contests are close, I have faith in the judges. 

I am writing them off. I'm sorry. I am. I am tired of having hope every off season only to be disappointed. It's rare when I'm not disappointed (2010, 2012, 2015) but more often than not as soon as I see the design I realize it's over. I just think as long and Dan and Chris are in charge it's going to get worse and worse.

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Correct me if I’m wrong. But, it’s my understanding that the director and executive director has nothing to do with program design. Isn’t that the design/program coordinator and the design staff? 

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2 hours ago, Madcityscout said:

Correct me if I’m wrong. But, it’s my understanding that the director and executive director has nothing to do with program design. Isn’t that the design/program coordinator and the design staff? 

Yes-and DP catches a lot of flack for other things as well, which are not part of his role. 

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2 hours ago, Madcityscout said:

Correct me if I’m wrong. But, it’s my understanding that the director and executive director has nothing to do with program design. Isn’t that the design/program coordinator and the design staff? 

So the director and executive director can distance themselves from competitive results?  Then why are they needed at all? To rent busses?

Edited by HockeyDad

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