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PopcornEater1963

Old Man DCI was cool...

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But you guys just don’t seem to be able to come to grips with the fact that modern DCI players are better musicians, in better physical shape, and put on superior productions than the geezers did. I figure if I have to look at that thread title every day about “I’m no longer supporting DCI ... who’s with me” it’s high time a counter argument was made, Fine .,, leave! Let the rest of us enjoy talent that is far superior to yours. 

I’ve read through that  31-page ************* of a thread and while I understand there are some admin concerns, the obvious pokes taken at today’s productions are laughable. 

It’s probably no wonder that current MM’s don’t get near this site. 

So... in short... I’ve been going to live DCI shows since 1978 and will continue to until I’m no longer here. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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31 minutes ago, PopcornEater1963 said:

But you guys just don’t seem to be able to come to grips with the fact that modern DCI players are better musicians, in better physical shape, and put on superior productions than the geezers did. I figure if I have to look at that thread title every day about “I’m no longer supporting DCI ... who’s with me” it’s high time a counter argument was made, Fine .,, leave! Let the rest of us enjoy talent that is far superior to yours. 

 

 

Seen their counter-arguments when I brought this up, that in one case, I insulted Al Chez et al. No insult intended, but a very cold observation.

 

What many of the don't realize is that there were some incredible individuals indeed, and quite, quite capable...they stood far, far out from the norm. The average kid... is an entirely different story.

I looked hard for the McCormick Video "The Challenge" to see if anyone had it up, I have a VHS of it somewhere. It's about a young rookie at Vanguard at their height circa 1975, featuring a "typical' Rookie Baritone player.  The kid's a nice typical kid from that era, somewhere around 13 to 15 years old, I can't remember. For that era, incredibly squared away. 

 

Tell me that kid makes SCV's brass section now, I dare anyone. It would be highly, highly unlikely a kid like that makes it now, yet there he is, in a top end horn line of that era likely ending up with a ring. He'd likely be thought of as too immature, no previous background in corps anywhere... I can go on. 

 

The average/mean musician in these corps is flat out way beyond the mean/average player 40 years ago. It wasn't  all too uncommon in many DCA (and likely some of the DCI units too, prolly on the lower end of the spectrum) corps in that era to have people that couldn't read music in the horn lines. 

 

Fewer spots and opportunities for performers in both DCI and DCA also mean the cream has risen by default. 

 

As for Davis at Cavies if I may use him as an example :worthy:... when I met him as a young man at CV, I can bluntly say he'd push me if we were in the same performing ensemble if I were in practice. Hard. In a very good way. I wasn't a slouch at 16, (PA All-State Band bound) but I have no compunctions saying I think he was better than I was at 16, also playing Lead in a top 6 DCA corps as he was. The horn he used... instruction... a better HS experience, all add up. Just my tuppence. If I pushed him even 1 percent, I'd be flattered.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, BigW said:

Seen their counter-arguments when I brought this up, that in one case, I insulted Al Chez et al. No insult intended, but a very cold observation.

 

What many of the don't realize is that there were some incredible individuals indeed, and quite, quite capable...they stood far, far out from the norm. The average kid... is an entirely different story.

I looked hard for the McCormick Video "The Challenge" to see if anyone had it up, I have a VHS of it somewhere. It's about a young rookie at Vanguard at their height circa 1975, featuring a "typical' Rookie Baritone player.  The kid's a nice typical kid from that era, somewhere around 13 to 15 years old, I can't remember. For that era, incredibly squared away. 

 

Tell me that kid makes SCV's brass section now, I dare anyone. It would be highly, highly unlikely a kid like that makes it now, yet there he is, in a top end horn line of that era likely ending up with a ring. He'd likely be thought of as too immature, no previous background in corps anywhere... I can go on. 

 

The average/mean musician in these corps is flat out way beyond the mean/average player 40 years ago. It wasn't  all too uncommon in many DCA (and likely some of the DCI units too, prolly on the lower end of the spectrum) corps in that era to have people that couldn't read music in the horn lines. 

 

Fewer spots and opportunities for performers in both DCI and DCA also mean the cream has risen by default. 

 

As for Davis at Cavies if I may use him as an example :worthy:... when I met him as a young man at CV, I can bluntly say he'd push me if we were in the same performing ensemble if I were in practice. Hard. In a very good way. I wasn't a slouch at 16, (PA All-State Band bound) but I have no compunctions saying I think he was better than I was at 16, also playing Lead in a top 6 DCA corps as he was. The horn he used... instruction... a better HS experience, all add up. Just my tuppence. If I pushed him even 1 percent, I'd be flattered.

 

 

I’m probably at a flash point tonight as the Cavaliers lost a tuba player to a skydiving accident this morning. I came over to DCP to see if anyone had posted anything, and since they hadn’t, I did. 

And then I see that same thread title about “refusing” to support DCI. Just sick of seeing it. It’s a cancer on this board. 

Davis remembers you well. And he attributes a major part of his success to learning from those who came before him. His uncle marched Spirit 79-81. 

Same uncle laughed out loud when he saw modern day audition material .  “No way no how we were ever asked to do anything close to that”. 

 

 

 

 

 

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14 minutes ago, BigW said:

Seen their counter-arguments when I brought this up, that in one case, I insulted Al Chez et al. No insult intended, but a very cold observation.

 

What many of the don't realize is that there were some incredible individuals indeed, and quite, quite capable...they stood far, far out from the norm. The average kid... is an entirely different story.

I looked hard for the McCormick Video "The Challenge" to see if anyone had it up, I have a VHS of it somewhere. It's about a young rookie at Vanguard at their height circa 1975, featuring a "typical' Rookie Baritone player.  The kid's a nice typical kid from that era, somewhere around 13 to 15 years old, I can't remember. For that era, incredibly squared away. 

 

Tell me that kid makes SCV's brass section now, I dare anyone. It would be highly, highly unlikely a kid like that makes it now, yet there he is, in a top end horn line of that era likely ending up with a ring. He'd likely be thought of as too immature, no previous background in corps anywhere... I can go on. 

 

The average/mean musician in these corps is flat out way beyond the mean/average player 40 years ago. It wasn't  all too uncommon in many DCA (and likely some of the DCI units too, prolly on the lower end of the spectrum) corps in that era to have people that couldn't read music in the horn lines. 

 

Fewer spots and opportunities for performers in both DCI and DCA also mean the cream has risen by default. 

 

As for Davis at Cavies if I may use him as an example :worthy:... when I met him as a young man at CV, I can bluntly say he'd push me if we were in the same performing ensemble if I were in practice. Hard. In a very good way. I wasn't a slouch at 16, (PA All-State Band bound) but I have no compunctions saying I think he was better than I was at 16, also playing Lead in a top 6 DCA corps as he was. The horn he used... instruction... a better HS experience, all add up. Just my tuppence. If I pushed him even 1 percent, I'd be flattered.

 

 

And for the record , 74 and 75 Muchachos , 75 Scouts, and 76 Blue Devils were the first shows I played for Davis way back when he first picked up a horn. I truly appreciate them. But the negative Nancy routine about today’s DCI gets tiring to read. 

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I'll go with Keith Hall's quote from another thread.

Is NOW better than THEN or is THEN better than NOW?

I like.....NOW was made better because of THEN! THEN was great and NOW is great!

With that said, agreed. To come on a Drum Corps board and state I no longer support DCI is rather pointless.

It's always been a great activity and is today (also agreed) better than ever. 

 

 

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I have yet to see anyone state that members back in the day were better players, in better shape, etc than today. Lot of complaints that today’s shows are not to the posters liking are most of what I’ve seen. IOW personal taste and opinion....

And..... the OP in not supporting DCI thread said “lack of common sense” so not sure in meaning was show design or the way DCI dropped the ball on protecting members

Edited by JimF-LowBari
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I have a different opinion on the worst thing posted:  the “if you don’t like it, leave” retort, or variations such as “nobody is making you read this thread”.  DCP would not exist if differing opinions went away. What would be the point of it?  I come here to read opposing viewpoints and challenging discussions. 

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13 hours ago, PopcornEater1963 said:

But you guys just don’t seem to be able to come to grips with the fact that modern DCI players are better musicians, in better physical shape, and put on superior productions than the geezers did. I figure if I have to look at that thread title every day about “I’m no longer supporting DCI ... who’s with me” it’s high time a counter argument was made, Fine .,, leave! Let the rest of us enjoy talent that is far superior to yours. 

I’ve read through that  31-page ************* of a thread and while I understand there are some admin concerns, the obvious pokes taken at today’s productions are laughable. 

It’s probably no wonder that current MM’s don’t get near this site. 

So... in short... I’ve been going to live DCI shows since 1978 and will continue to until I’m no longer here. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

thanks for sharing. if you think the Forums are full of grumpy old men, i'd like to direct you to the DCP facebook page.

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6 hours ago, PopcornEater1963 said:

I’m probably at a flash point tonight as the Cavaliers lost a tuba player to a skydiving accident this morning. I came over to DCP to see if anyone had posted anything, and since they hadn’t, I did. 

And then I see that same thread title about “refusing” to support DCI. Just sick of seeing it. It’s a cancer on this board. 

Davis remembers you well. And he attributes a major part of his success to learning from those who came before him. His uncle marched Spirit 79-81. 

Same uncle laughed out loud when he saw modern day audition material .  “No way no how we were ever asked to do anything close to that”. 

 

 

 

 

 

again, this place is tame. seek out several facebook groups, including DCP.

 

and there's nowhere that says this place or any other has to be all sunshine and roses. if that easily offended, i suggest you seek out only the places that allow that and only that

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5 hours ago, JimF-LowBari said:

 

And..... the OP in not supporting DCI thread said “lack of common sense” so not sure in meaning was show design or the way DCI dropped the ball on protecting members

The OP in the not supporting DCI thread was in reference to how DCI dropped the ball on member safety and how DCI overreacted to Arsenal’s then Corps Director’s social media post offering reduced tour fees to Pioneer and OC alums. The not supporting DCI thread opened the same day as DCI’s slap down of that director. It was not started to bemoan the direction of show design or the evolution of electronics or props, but it morphed into those realms.

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