garfield Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 17 minutes ago, Poppycock said: Interested in seeing the minutes of these meetings and those listed as subject matter experts. Something tells me this has more to do with livelihoods and less about participants. Increase revenues can be a great motivator. This, again, is a statement designed to hint that shenanigans are going on and that DCI actually has some nefarious intent than actually hearing from SMEs. You know, like the decibel analysis created by OSHA and submitted with their "Sound Reinforcement" proposal. It's bizarre bordering on silly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HockeyDad Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 1 hour ago, cybersnyder said: I worked at a start up that was using that model. We'll lose money on each individual sale but make up for it in volume. Well...if the per-unit production cost goes down when production volume goes up, the yes, you would make up for it. Now you’ve sucked me into this.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppycock Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 2 minutes ago, xandandl said: Remembering when Adolph DeGrauwe of Cavies and David Glasgow of Bloo did that with past proposals (electronix, e.g.) and eventually had to buckled under as judges rewarded the proposed changes scorewise. Designers, staff, costume, flag, props and instrument manufacturers are all driving the individual organization budgets. All in the name of providing more inclusion and member experience. Doesn’t take much to figure out who stands to benefit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, garfield said: This, again, is a statement designed to hint that shenanigans are going on and that DCI actually has some nefarious intent than actually hearing from SMEs. You know, like the decibel analysis created by OSHA and submitted with their "Sound Reinforcement" proposal. It's bizarre bordering on silly. If you and DCI are NOT trying to hide anything, what good reason would you raise for not granting Poppycock his wish to read through the discussion and minutes of the committee which supposedly generated these proposals? You proport yourself as knowing who signed what and how. Poppycock usually seems to be reasonable, even insightful, often dramatic with his posts. Why not be transparent? What is being hidden or feared? Edited January 4, 2020 by xandandl 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppycock Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 7 minutes ago, garfield said: This, again, is a statement designed to hint that shenanigans are going on and that DCI actually has some nefarious intent than actually hearing from SMEs. You know, like the decibel analysis created by OSHA and submitted with their "Sound Reinforcement" proposal. It's bizarre bordering on silly. You’re not the only person entitled to an opinion and just because you say so doesn’t make it so. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terri Schehr Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 17 minutes ago, xandandl said: If you and DCI are NOT trying to hide anything, what good reason would you raise for not granting Poppycock his wish to read through the discussion and minutes of the committee which supposedly generated these proposals? You proport yourself as knowing who signed what and how. Poppycock usually seems to be reasonable, even insightful, often dramatic with his posts. Why not be transparent? What is being hidden or feared? I think it would be a gesture of good faith to make the minutes available to the fan base. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 1 minute ago, xandandl said: If you and DCI are NOT trying to hide anything, what good reason would you raise for not granting Poppycock his wish to read through the discussion and minutes of the committee which supposedly generated these proposals? You proport yourself as knowing who signed what and how. Poppycock usually seems to be reasonable, even insightful, often dramatic with his posts. Why not be transparent? What is being hidden? What in the world would I have to be hiding in any of this? I'm just asking for some rationality in looking at these proposals! All this tin-foil hat stuff... You're right, Poppycock is certainly entitled to state his opinion but I'm also entitled to call out BS when I believe I'm seeing it. I won't disagree that you find some of his posts "insightful" or "reasonable" - that's YOUR opinion - but, on this one, I think he's crafting reasons to foment distrust in what DCI does and assigning meaning to what is really only his negative speculation on ulterior motives. DCI can document committees and meetings and processes and SME's but, still, the opinion is that there's some nefarious alter-reason and any call out of BS is taken as an intent to hide some made up truth. Presume Positive Intent. Start with that. Presume the SME's are there for a reason, given deference and respect, and actions were developed after consideration of their, and other, input. To ask such is not evidence of a cover up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppycock Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 2 minutes ago, garfield said: What in the world would I have to be hiding in any of this? I'm just asking for some rationality in looking at these proposals! All this tin-foil hat stuff... You're right, Poppycock is certainly entitled to state his opinion but I'm also entitled to call out BS when I believe I'm seeing it. I won't disagree that you find some of his posts "insightful" or "reasonable" - that's YOUR opinion - but, on this one, I think he's crafting reasons to foment distrust in what DCI does and assigning meaning to what is really only his negative speculation on ulterior motives. DCI can document committees and meetings and processes and SME's but, still, the opinion is that there's some nefarious alter-reason and any call out of BS is taken as an intent to hide some made up truth. Presume Positive Intent. Start with that. Presume the SME's are there for a reason, given deference and respect, and actions were developed after consideration of their, and other, input. To ask such is not evidence of a cover up. BS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 2 minutes ago, garfield said: What in the world would I have to be hiding in any of this? I'm just asking for some rationality in looking at these proposals! All this tin-foil hat stuff... You're right, Poppycock is certainly entitled to state his opinion but I'm also entitled to call out BS when I believe I'm seeing it. I won't disagree that you find some of his posts "insightful" or "reasonable" - that's YOUR opinion - but, on this one, I think he's crafting reasons to foment distrust in what DCI does and assigning meaning to what is really only his negative speculation on ulterior motives. DCI can document committees and meetings and processes and SME's but, still, the opinion is that there's some nefarious alter-reason and any call out of BS is taken as an intent to hide some made up truth. Presume Positive Intent. Start with that. Presume the SME's are there for a reason, given deference and respect, and actions were developed after consideration of their, and other, input. To ask such is not evidence of a cover up. and to make the conversations publicly available will prove that. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 21 minutes ago, Poppycock said: You’re not the only person entitled to an opinion and just because you say so doesn’t make it so. I'm sorry, but this sounds like stuff from a grade school recess. You're making contentions that DCI's proposals (I presume many, if not all) are motivated by career and financial gain of adults in the activity and the burden of proof lies with you, not with me when I call BS. Until you do that, I can call it a BS contention and dismiss it out of hand, which is what I've done. Hitchens (na, na na, na na, nahhhh) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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