Madison Scouts 2023

[Gantang]

On 8/6/2023 at 9:31 AM, Slingerland said:

Stewart made some bonehead moves in the early 2000s that changed the trajectory, so it's not completely wrong to point at him as a foundational element in the decline.

Not attending critiques or sending his non-English speaking Japanese members pretty much told the ac cctiviy that the Madison Scouts didn't give a ##### about what judges had to say. That sent a message to the members that Scott didn't give a ##### and that the ONLY thing that mattered was getting claps. Letting the corps slip out of the top 12 was his death knell. 

Edited August 7, 2023 by Toby
Filter circumvention

[Phantom56]

Can anyone remember the last year Madison placed as low as 17th at DCI finals? Sad to see--hopefully they will bring in some new staff next year, and begin climbing back up again. 

[HockeyDad]

On 8/6/2023 at 11:04 AM, Gantang said:

Not attending critiques or sending his non-English speaking Japanese members pretty much told the ac cctiviy that the Madison Scouts didn't give a **** about what judges had to say. That sent a message to the members that Scott didn't give a **** and that the ONLY thing that mattered was getting claps. Letting the corps slip out of the top 12 was his death knell. 

Right.  That did happen.  And that has what to do with what’s happening 21 years later?  Nothing. You cannot blame Scott Stewart for what we see a generation later.  That’s nothing but a bait-and-switch to excuse the present leadership team, which has had more than enough time to show progress but has not delivered.
 

Extrapolating that flawed logic, I guess Bill Howard brought them the 1988 championship. It was only 12 years after he passed the baton, after all. Ridiculous. 

[Gantang]

12 minutes ago, HockeyDad said:

Right.  That did happen.  And that has what to do with what’s happening 21 years later?  

I was specifically responding to what he wrote about Scott's bonehead moves.

"Stewart made some bonehead moves in the early 2000s that changed the trajectory, so it's not completely wrong to point at him as a foundational element in the decline."

Not that it's Scott's fault that the corps can't rise through the ranks 20 years later. But his actions did begin a downward trajectory when he was asked how far he was willing to let the corps' placement slip, and he was unwilling to commit to the Board's desire to remain competitive. The following year the guard was practically non-existent, which in turn made recruiting guard members in the following years impossible. You get the point.

The dismal competitiveness and lower-tier talent throughout the ranks has everything to do with current leadership. 

[Slingerland]

8 minutes ago, HockeyDad said:

You cannot blame Scott Stewart for what’s happening a generation later.  Extrapolating that flawed logic, I guess Bill Howard brought them the 1988 championship. It was only 12 years after he passed the baton, after all. 

It's absolutely correct to attribute the foundational excellence that Howard brought to the organization in the 70s as playing a part in setting the 80s and 90s Scouts up to succeed, the same way that most of us would credit Jerry Seawright for having established the metric of success at BD when he was the guy there, something that his successors carried forward. 
 

[bobjective]

Maybe Madison needs to take a competitive year off like SOA did and try to reset their competitive goal as and/or mindset. It appears to have worked for SOA. Someone has suggested that Madison might consider dropping down to competing in open class for a while. I honestly don’t know how that would bode well for their future in trying to come back to world class after competing in open class for a couple of years. 

[madison1988]

18 hours ago, C.Holland said:

well...  let's look at where this all started when it was degrading.  2000... i love Scott Stewart but he was cheap as all f.   2001... lets' get volunteers to design the show and see what happens... 2002... ooops... this is the beginning of the end. 

so let's go the obvious answer. (seriously, this isn't structural engineering here...  its a VERY simple answer that you already know)  unless you're thick af. 

 

the answer of "what did they do differently..."

they pumped literal s*** tons of money into their program and brought in a bunch of big names and then recruited the top of the top talent.  every one of these programs went from "building mode" to "finals mode" when someone showed up and dropped a pile of cash into the bank and they pushed everyone out and replaced it all with cash, names, and talent.   

You need designers unencumbered to bring the art... and you need talent that needs ZERO teaching beyond teaching them the show.  The less time teaching fundamentals the more time you spend teaching someone to stand on their head, playing 64th note runs, while juggling f'n chainsaws with their feet. 

welcome to 2023. (actually 1988... when money changed DCI)
money buys a finals spot.  you want a finals spot? cool.  bring some money.  a whole f'n giant pile of it.   not "i want to be a finals/champion of a regional band circuit" money... like I want to win a f'n tony money.  Like "i want to win best picture" type of money.   

Bloo had Doug, and then they threw a bunch of money at the rest of the show.  Nevermind the member experience (yes.. my students who marched there had some therapy bills to pay after their tenure)... that's a very different forum and likely needs a lawyer to moderate.  

you wanna be back on top?   Bring a giant f'n bag of money that makes even Scrooge McDuck blush, and then they can fire the design team and teaching staff (and all you old ####s can finally just stfu), replace them with people straight out of broadway, julie taymore? Mike Arden? Marianne Elliott?  Alex Timbers? sure, they'll gladly show up to assemble a show if the project is the right fit, and the cash is the right fit.  and boom.  come get your second place medal to BD since the best f'n team you want to design a show isn't leaving concord unless you buy them a private island in the domain of their choosing.  (and also let them still spend most of their time in the experience world that they've built in BD land)

I just want the crowd to stand up again. We can work on the rest later. 

[GetOFFmyDot]

Stewart made significantly more serious offensive actions than pissing off judges or sending those with limited English to hear recaps.   
 

 

[ComicJeff2012]

18 minutes ago, GetOFFmyDot said:

Stewart made significantly more serious offensive actions than pissing off judges or sending those with limited English to hear recaps.   
 

 

Like what?

[1992AllOverAgain]

 

22 hours ago, Gantang said:

sending his non-English speaking Japanese members 

wow