4 DAYS TILL DCI SCHEDULE RELEASE?

[Tim K]

9 hours ago, TOC said:

Let's say your sources are correct.  What are the thoughts on these corps holding weekend camps, collecting fees for them, start collecting the tour fees, and hoping to get into the black to have a tour? It hasn't gone well for some other corps who tried to have a tour with low funds.

I think the corps need to be as upfront as possible. It’s not unreasonable for corps to say without X number of members we can’t field a corps and my guess is more astute kids trying out and vets would know the chances of a corps making it in the summer. I would say weekend camp fees are reasonable if the corps has a shot at fielding in the summer. You always have a wide range of talent and ability, including a good number who may just be curious and those who do not have a reasonable chance. As far as collecting tour fees, they should absolutely be refunded and a corps should announce as early as possible it should be announced there will not be a summer tour. 

[craiga]

4 hours ago, cixelsyd said:

That is surprising.  I am not sure how to react.

a.  Every time we have a debate about props, tarps, amp-the-whole-corps electronics or annual costume changes, people tell us all the corps are flush with cash and can afford these luxuries.

b.  Every time we discuss finances in any sense, the case is made that the vast majority of member corps are flush with cash and any who are not are simply examples of "bad management".  If two member corps are broke and 20 are not, then we must have two member corps with "bad management". 

Maybe if instead of two corps, 20 member corps were in varying degrees of abnormally increased financial crisis right now, then amputating a whole region off the tour could be cast as a proportional response to the situation.

We absolutely have two examples of corps with bad management,  which is precisely why they are allegedly broke.  Both of the corps are renowned, in fact for mismanagement,  so neither will come as a surprise to anyone. 

[Barneveld]

11 minutes ago, craiga said:

We absolutely have two examples of corps with bad management,  which is precisely why they are allegedly broke.  Both of the corps are renowned, in fact for mismanagement,  so neither will come as a surprise to anyone. 

I would place at least 6 of the current world class corps in that category.

[craiga]

I don't disagree, but for the record, neither of these two corps are in the top 12.

[scheherazadesghost]

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Edited June 13, 2023 by scheherazadesghost

[scheherazadesghost]

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Edited June 13, 2023 by scheherazadesghost

[C.Holland]

On 12/3/2022 at 9:51 AM, corps8294 said:

I agree with the comments of Tim K. There are not enough corps to effectively run regional tours, anymore. The years of DCM, DCE, DCW, DCS are gone. We all remember the days of first tour being regional leading up to the big midseason regional show and second tour being the big shows where everyone, finally, meets up on their way to DCI. Open Class and DCA are hanging on by rope (although they are pretty close to a thread). 
Even the most well off corps have taken measures to maintain stability and sustainability. This is a much different era for drum corps and DCI than it was decades ago. 

There’s no requirement to operate a home show anymore. Has been this way for many years.  Only a few host shows because it gives them easier access to housing for their own groups. In times when they’d be stuck on the road elsewhere. Heck, they’ll even host the show for a loss if it helps to alleviate housing costs. 
 

there are 4 corps with solid revenue sources from gaming or musical service programs.  Everyone else relies on their member dues, donations, and a few corporate sponsors (if their board is good enough to obtain these). 
 

every nonprofit has operational and funding concerns, the difference between those with a building and those who are touring is the one with a building has something they can connect with locals easier, and donors can consistently see where their funding goes.  They can also institute a rental program of their facilities.  (Though this is a double edge sword as 51% of operating revenue, depending on filing, must still be unearned to maintain non profit status, so the more rental income you receive, the more donations the board needs to find) 

Edited December 4, 2022 by C.Holland

[C.Holland]

11 minutes ago, scheherazadesghost said:

This got me thinking.

Why do the excess work of maintaining nonprofit status this is the case? I find that the mechanisms of nonprofits can create more barriers than benefits at a certain point. Missions? Boards of directors? They serve their purpose but not if the income has shifted so dramatically away from a diversified, robust portfolio of donors. (Which corps really had that in the first place?) Besides, there are for-profit entities like L3Cs or B corps that straddle mission and profit for a reason.

The only reasons for holding on to 501c3 at this point that I can see could be to (1) maintain the appearance of being a charity and (2) collect donations from wealthy peeps. Neither one (alone or in tandem) will save a struggling nonprofit. They'll just help 'em kick the can down the road until they're forced to change.

Now, if corps wanted to shift and hire folks who could help them get larger scale grants using their nonprofit status, that's one thing. I've just not seen evidence that anyone's interested in doing so.

I believe there’s the fear that if they become for-profit, it monetizes the student (more than now) and it then puts labor requirements and taxation concerns onto the organization. 

[scheherazadesghost]

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Edited June 13, 2023 by scheherazadesghost

[Tim K]

1 hour ago, C.Holland said:

There’s no requirement to operate a home show anymore. Has been this way for many years.  Only a few host shows because it gives them easier access to housing for their own groups. In times when they’d be stuck on the road elsewhere. Heck, they’ll even host the show for a loss if it helps to alleviate housing costs. 
 

there are 4 corps with solid revenue sources from gaming or musical service programs.  Everyone else relies on their member dues, donations, and a few corporate sponsors (if their board is good enough to obtain these). 
 

every nonprofit has operational and funding concerns, the difference between those with a building and those who are touring is the one with a building has something they can connect with locals easier, and donors can consistently see where their funding goes.  They can also institute a rental program of their facilities.  (Though this is a double edge sword as 51% of operating revenue, depending on filing, must still be unearned to maintain non profit status, so the more rental income you receive, the more donations the board needs to find) 

Regarding home shows, I think for some corps they are critical, others not so much. A number of the shows I’ve attended were hosted by Boston Crusaders. Up until about 2009 or so, I don’t know if I could say how a BAC show differed from Bristol or Beanpot other than BAC shows were not the traffic nightmare of Bristol prior to July 4th and you couldn’t get the  Fish n’ Chips dinner at a BAC show that you could get at Beanpot. About 2009 BAC started using their home show as a way to build up support for the corps in the wider drum corps community which was no small feat. In the 1970’s or early 80’s, no one would have imagined North Star alums would sit on the BAC board or 27th alums in the stands cheering BAC to victory! 🙂 Seriously we grow up but what Boston Crusaders did do effectively was convince people that their drum corps, drill team, or parish band may no longer exist, but what you see in Boston Crusaders is a continuation of that legacy. At home shows they build up a donor base. While BAC has other financial resources, they still build that community feel. Cadets used home shows to their advantage though from 2010 onward if you were a certain former director, mingling in the stands was not a wise idea. Crown uses home shows to their advantage too, combining killing you with kindness and Southern hospitality.