A follow up message from CA&E's Board Chairperson

[NewToPosting]

What's less rare is people who work in iterative environments (software development, manaufacturing/continuous improvement, production of any sort). 

The iterative nature of drum corps (put something on the field, then tweak it, then max it out) is very useful in lots of careers. Coordinating "across captions" is also very helpful. 

In other words, the value isn't in producing pro performers (though that's great), the value is the educational component, which can be applied across career trajectories.

[Jeff Ream]

16 hours ago, Chris RL FHNSAB said:

More will be forthcoming Jeff.  Please reread John's note to answer your question.  

didn't really answer anything but ok.

[musicteacher]

New To Posting is absolutely right.

[ykw]

18 hours ago, Jeff Ream said:

didn't really answer anything but ok.

Or as Don Henley put it....

"Well, I coulda' been an actor, but I wound up here
I just have to look good, I don't have to be clear
Come and whisper in my ear
Give us dirty laundry

You don't really need to find out what's goin' on
You don't really wanna know just how far it's gone
Just leave well enough alone
Eat your dirty laundry

Kick 'em when they're up
Kick 'em when they're down
Kick 'em when they're up
Kick 'em when they're down"

 

Edited October 19, 2023 by ykw

[scheherazadesghost]

On 10/18/2023 at 7:11 AM, NewToPosting said:

What's less rare is people who work in iterative environments (software development, manaufacturing/continuous improvement, production of any sort). 

The iterative nature of drum corps (put something on the field, then tweak it, then max it out) is very useful in lots of careers. Coordinating "across captions" is also very helpful. 

In other words, the value isn't in producing pro performers (though that's great), the value is the educational component, which can be applied across career trajectories.

One of my points though, is that other activities do this just as well, if not better (activities like college, military, internships, and early job experience.) So, what is the incentive for young people to spend potentially more money and less time investing in these other activities to do drum corps? Again, especially if drum corps doesn't pull kids off the streets anymore (meaning, they wouldn't otherwise get this kind of skill set anywhere else)?

I'm asking for the brain trust here to firmly state what makes drum corps unique and special in a way that these other activities aren't? This way, we can clarify what spending the extra time and money is for when it's not directly, concretely going to helping members get jobs they'll soon need.

There are posts on reddit of young people selling plasma and starting OnlyFans sites to pay for drum corps. The activity has to do better than that for them.

[Terri Schehr]

6 minutes ago, scheherazadesghost said:

One of my points though, is that other activities do this just as well, if not better (activities like college, military, internships, and early job experience.) So, what is the incentive for young people to spend potentially more money and less time investing in these other activities to do drum corps? Again, especially if drum corps doesn't pull kids off the streets anymore (meaning, they wouldn't otherwise get this kind of skill set anywhere else)?

I'm asking for the brain trust here to firmly state what makes drum corps unique and special in a way that these other activities aren't? This way, we can clarify what spending the extra time and money is for when it's not directly, concretely going to helping members get jobs they'll soon need.

There are posts on reddit of young people selling plasma and starting OnlyFans sites to pay for drum corps. The activity has to do better than that for them.

I saw the plasma posts.  I couldn’t believe what I was reading.  

[HockeyDad]

1 hour ago, scheherazadesghost said:

One of my points though, is that other activities do this just as well, if not better (activities like college, military, internships, and early job experience.) So, what is the incentive for young people to spend potentially more money and less time investing in these other activities to do drum corps? Again, especially if drum corps doesn't pull kids off the streets anymore (meaning, they wouldn't otherwise get this kind of skill set anywhere else)?

I'm asking for the brain trust here to firmly state what makes drum corps unique and special in a way that these other activities aren't? This way, we can clarify what spending the extra time and money is for when it's not directly, concretely going to helping members get jobs they'll soon need.

There are posts on reddit of young people selling plasma and starting OnlyFans sites to pay for drum corps. The activity has to do better than that for them.

Well, you probably consider this an opposing view, but anyway, I don’t think everything one does needs to be with an eye to how it can lead to a future job or whatever. Sometimes it’s good to do something for no other reason than it’s fun or it’s your passion at the moment. And leave it at that.  Yes it’s a lot of money and sounds like the plaything of the wealthy kids or kids from families who can afford the tuition.  Is that not what drum corps has largely become anyway?  
 

Tons of kids spend lots of time playing soccer, baseball, hockey, you name it, and it never leads to a job. But the friends made, the experiences, the fun of it all, isn’t that what it should be about anyway?  To make a living from soccer or hockey or basketball or whatever, you need to be the elite of the elite. So the other 99.9 percent of us better be going into it without greater expectations. Just my thoughts. 
 

So what makes drum corps unique and special?  For those who get it, no explanation is necessary. For those who don’t, no explanation is possible. 

Edited October 19, 2023 by HockeyDad

[scheherazadesghost]

17 minutes ago, HockeyDad said:

Well, you probably consider this an opposing view, but anyway, I don’t think everything one does needs to be with an eye to how it can lead to a future job or whatever. Sometimes it’s good to do something for no other reason than it’s fun or it’s your passion at the moment. And leave it at that.  Yes it’s a lot of money and sounds like the plaything of the wealthy kids or kids from families who can afford the tuition.  Is that not what drum corps has largely become anyway?  

Not oppositional per se. I mean, look, I have two degrees in dance, a combo of 6 years in school and a decade+ sacrificed to exactly what you're talking about. So in a way, you sound not only like my college advisors, but, for a while, like I did. The argument can be expanded to include all humanities and arts, right? Impractical to some, invaluable to others.

As for being a plaything for wealthy kids, I think this is a sad loss of marching member diversity. So I have a problem with it. Yes, it's how it's been for a while, but that doesn't make it okay or beyond remedy. I'm not one to throw my hands up here and say nothing can be done.

I'll put this out there, I struggled financially for most of my adult life because I dedicated my time to exactly such pursuits... to advisors, employers, etc who indicated time and time again that the field of dance wouldn't exist without my time (and those like me of course) and financial sacrifices. A lot of time and money is lost pursuing these things when perhaps just one mentor/sponsor could've taken me aside to say hey, there are easier ways to do this thing called financial security. Nowhere along the way did that happen because arts and nonprofits rely on workers who will take less and less pay. Scarcity mentality. I've had to figure security out on my own with the limited skill sets afforded to me by this mindset and the limited real world skills I had developed with that mindset and in those fields. Decades went by before I did, and the whole time I was toiling, winning grants, traveling abroad to perform... but toiling because this thing called art couldn't push out a decent salary or sustainable living. My story is part of this whole "do it for the fun of it" mindset. So yeah, I've lived exactly what you're explaining and am plastering it here as a cautionary tale.

17 minutes ago, HockeyDad said:

Tons of kids spend lots of time playing soccer, baseball, hockey, you name it, and it never leads to a job. But the friends made, the experiences, the fun of it all, isn’t that what it should be about anyway?  To make a living from soccer or hockey or basketball or whatever, you need to be the elite of the elite. So the other 99.9 percent of us better be going into it without greater expectations. Just my thoughts. 

Yes to the experiences and fun of it all, but when young people are donating plasma or doing Only Fans, risking life long injury from overtraining (not even simply poor health team choices)... and then also potentially facing abusive situations (like I and many others did), I continue to question the payoff. I still believe that the vast majority of marching members don't experience these adverse aspects of drum corps, but the risk remains ever-present. And a single failed mission in the case of one adverse experience is still failure.

I see you re: greater expectations, but again, I question whether budget conscious young people will continue to choose drum corps experiences over others that afford them all the same job building skill sets + fun and friends. Younger generations are less able to afford the time and financial expenses than we were. It's a real concern.

17 minutes ago, HockeyDad said:

So what makes drum corps unique and special?  For those who get it, no explanation is necessary. For those who don’t, no explanation is possible. 

Sure. But I'm asking this as a thought experiment. These things will have to be clearly and distinctly defined (rather than assumed) for outside donors and sponsors to buy in. If corps want to increase the diversity of their revenue streams, this will be important. Otherwise, they'll have to continue to pull from fewer and fewer alumni who can afford to give.

[waliman4444]

As opposed to eliminating the excessive sodium and sugar on own, we wait until #### happens( symptoms)    and          then substitute good health practice with diet soda..Forgetting or ignoring the source of the problem....    Drum Corps 2023...peace

[2000Cadet]

On 10/16/2023 at 1:48 PM, Chris RL FHNSAB said:

I'm secretary of the board of directors at Cadets, if that helps.  Trying to keep accurate information flowing, and not gossip from those who do not know what they are speaking about.

On 10/16/2023 at 5:58 PM, Chris RL FHNSAB said:

Thanks Jeff.  Your information is incorrect.  Our transportation challenges were with a bad bus company, which we chose to replace and reallocate those funds for a new one at championship week.  This decision had nothing to do with anyone leaving, in fact Denise spearheaded the removal of the bus company and replacement.  

Rumors are just that. Rumors.  If you have questions, ask us/me.  We will continue to be as transparent as we can, knowing that we speak as one BOD.  Thanks for the compliment.

Quoting these posts as this person clearly is one who was ACTUALLY in the room...

Edited October 19, 2023 by 2000Cadet