Jacob Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 There are not really any championship shows that I would ever say I "hate" - but the ones that I have recordings of on my old iPhone that I use when I'm making long drives and need a playlist of several hours of music include all the champions from 1983-2008. Of the championship shows within that range, there are a few moments within certain shows that I tend to skip over - usually not because I dislike that section, but rather I want to skip ahead to my favorite part. So here are the moments within a championship show that I have often skipped over: 1983 Garfield Cadets - I tend to skip through some of the middle section of the show - mainly some of the more light-hearted and dance-like poly-meter sections. The main reason is because I feel like it doesn't fit the same majesty that the rest of the show has (of course having contrast is a great thing too because it shows the ability of the corps to handle various styles) 1988 Madison Scouts - from the middle section of the opener (starting with the fugue section) until the end of the opener. The main reason is because the lead soprano entrance always makes me cringe just a little bit on their passage with a few fracks and the 2nd and 3rd notes being not completely in tune as a section). 1991 Star of Indiana - just wish the slow ballad section could have been a little bit longer - I have always felt that it would add more to the show if the slower tempo and less intense section of the Pines of Rome could have lasted a little bit longer - letting the hornline show off some of their lushness along with the amazing technique displayed in the rest of the show. 2001 Cavaliers - the beginning of the closer with "Rainbow" thrown into the melody - it just seems so out of place surrounded by the rest of the show's themes. I'll be honest that I have not watched 2009, 2010 or 2012 Blue Devils very much - and their shows did not spark a great deal of excitement within me as a viewer, however I don't feel I've given them a fair enough shake to be able to say why I haven't gotten to know these shows better. And again - I do NOT dislike any of these shows - however, those sections listed above are just the sections that I sometimes either skip over or wish they could be enhanced or different somehow. Also, I'll be honest that I like to skip ahead to moments I like better than those, so that is why they may be judged harshly. Enjoy! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjeffeory Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 Some of the comments lead me to seeing that as well. I went through the thread again and I know it's only a select few. Yes, it's those few comments that just ruin it for me. It just seems like this thread is a good opportunity to bag on whatever corps one doesn't care for... I do agree with perc2100 though. If the discussion doesn't devolve, then we could possible get some good conversation going... I've already seen it "go there" though... I will continue to read through more posts though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mello Dude Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 I would say the most standout show I simply don't like and never liked after seeing it live a bunch of times and now on video and audio is BD 2010. Not that is wasn't done well but there was really no meat to that production IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lincoln Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 1983 Garfield Cadets - I tend to skip through some of the middle section of the show - mainly some of the more light-hearted and dance-like poly-meter sections. The main reason is because I feel like it doesn't fit the same majesty that the rest of the show has (of course having contrast is a great thing too because it shows the ability of the corps to handle various styles) If you are referring to the Bernstein's "Mass" portion of the show, there was a time when I would have agreed with you. I remember thinking how strange that section was. It didn't seem to follow the normal pace of a drum corps show. I also remember being really disappointed that the guard didn't use rifles during any part of the show and then pulled out shawls and chinese lanterns to dance around the field with. It's funny how one's perception can change as time passes. I now think that portion of the show is incredible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 (edited) If you are referring to the Bernstein's "Mass" portion of the show, there was a time when I would have agreed with you. I remember thinking how strange that section was. It didn't seem to follow the normal pace of a drum corps show. I also remember being really disappointed that the guard didn't use rifles during any part of the show and then pulled out shawls and chinese lanterns to dance around the field with. It's funny how one's perception can change as time passes. I now think that portion of the show is incredible. Rifles/weapons would have been very inappropriate for that portion of the show when the corps played the music from Bernstein's Mass. George Zingali more than once publicly explained to the guard members and to the public/judges that the use of the shawls was because the female guard was portraying the Women of Jerusalem, as in the Stations of the Cross (#8 traditional form, #9 newer forms) and Scripturally cited in Luke. 23:28-31. The use of the lanterns expressed the change of mood, reflected the Light of the World (John 8:12) theme of hope, and was another religious reference so often used by Zingali both for his shows with Cadets and Star. Bernstein's interpretation of the Roman Catholic Mass was religious matter and the corps used religious symbols to express the source music. The "Chinese" lanterns were doable rather than candles or such, expressed the other culture which Bernstein cited (the Viet Nam conflict), and presented a softness appropriate for the temper of the music. Edited February 25, 2015 by xandandl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tad_MMA Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 (edited) Also, and I know this is blasphemous, but I'm not a huge fan of 89 SCV. Mainly because I LOVE the 88 version. There was some better execution in 89, but visually a lot of it was a pale imitation of what they had done the year before, and it was no where near as theatrical or emotional. Why is this "blasphemous?" There were *many* disappointed (bewildered, addled, confused, shocked) Phantom Reg fans in KC that night. SCV was lucky in that they DID play better in '89 than '88 (not much---but better), and their feet were more focused. Everything else was the same from 1988. I still find their decision to repeat the show (at least 80% of it---if not more) an incredibly cheap move given the rich history. Except for the 1997-1999 run, they no longer lead. They follow and not too closely. Also, that horrible judging system of 1988 & 89 could very well have "robbed" them of the '88 title and Phantom of the '89. Seriously? One needn't have a doctorate in Brassology to hear the OBVIOUS difference in PR's/SCV's hornlines, yet 0.1 was the spread. Ditto GE Brass. Plus, had SCV won in '88, I doubt they'd have rehashed. But that's all conjecture, but without it, the internecks would require 80% less bandwidth (also conjecture). Edited February 26, 2015 by Tad_MMA 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tobias Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 83 Cadets were wonderful. It was an elegance and sophistication of SCV only from an east coast corps. It was an unexpected surprise to see this corps transform from a group that barely made finals in 1980 to win in 1983. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lincoln Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 Rifles/weapons would have been very inappropriate for that portion of the show when the corps played the music from Bernstein's Mass. George Zingali more than once publicly explained to the guard members and to the public/judges that the use of the shawls was because the female guard was portraying the Women of Jerusalem, as in the Stations of the Cross (#8 traditional form, #9 newer forms) and Scripturally cited in Luke. 23:28-31. The use of the lanterns expressed the change of mood, reflected the Light of the World (John 8:12) theme of hope, and was another religious reference so often used by Zingali both for his shows with Cadets and Star. Bernstein's interpretation of the Roman Catholic Mass was religious matter and the corps used religious symbols to express the source music. The "Chinese" lanterns were doable rather than candles or such, expressed the other culture which Bernstein cited (the Viet Nam conflict), and presented a softness appropriate for the temper of the music. Thank you for the background information - it is really interesting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim K Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 I do not have to like a championship show to understand why a show wins. That being said, there are only a handful of championship shows that have been my favorite of that year: SCV in 89 and Crown in 2013 come to mind. for Cadets, Cavies, Star, Phantom, and Madison, my favorite shows from these corps has not been a championship show. For BD, 2014eas my favorite show. Overall, I did not like 2009 or 2010 BD. 81 SCV did not set me on fire either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 (edited) 83 Cadets were wonderful. It was an elegance and sophistication of SCV only from an east coast corps. It was an unexpected surprise to see this corps transform from a group that barely made finals in 1980 to win in 1983. The official versions of those years, the backstories, and the realities all coalesce into an amazing transformation which included not only the public figures seeing new possibilities but phenomenal members who worked extremely hard, often under and through quite stressing situations with the corps and at home which eventually worked out. For instance there were no less than 8 deaths of members' parents, siblings, and living-with-them grandparents that had to be dealt with on the 1983 tour. So many of the members of those years came from corps which had previously already folded for a variety of reasons and the members had a hunger that they could do more before finally aging out. They came, they worked, they stayed and they worked even more. The designers and instructors most certainly were inspired by SCV under Gail Royer who all held in high esteem for the elan and consistency he brought to the activity and competitive field. The combination of both tradition and innovation was re-framed; the youth of the staff was a unique aspect which brought both energy and possibility. Edited February 26, 2015 by xandandl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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