Official DCP G7 Proposal Discussion Thread

[MarimbasaurusRex]

G7???

Bb7 seems much more appropriate.

[Fred Windish]

Bob984,

Please understand, I don't expect DCI to go away. I do expect it to shrink and have a more difficult time. The remaining corps can STILL put on some good shows, maybe not so many. With limited audience dollars to tap, the remaining groups will sometimes be in competition with a VERY formidable alternative.

What's interesting here is, the Ambitious Seven seem to understand their plan only works best WITHIN the current structure. They must know, they need the non-elite weekday show revenue to make it all work. I mean, what are they going to do Monday thru Thursday, as they move from one elite weekend event to the next? For reasons of stability and comfort, the Ambitious Seven NEEDS the existing DCI right now.

There's also the matter of souvie sales, DVDs, etc. This new concept demands a completely new level of all that. I would think the elite groups will want to keep this income separate.

Look, an evening of the Ambitious Seven WILL be spectacular. It will be the pinnacle of what this genre can provide at the time. I believe such evenings will succeed. Alas, for the benefit of a smaller group of organizations.

Can this smaller group "pull it off?" Yes, and why not?

I can see this group negotiating hotel rates, collectively purchasing props, sound, lighting, mixing materials, back drops, tractor trailers for all of this, etc. Everything to be used by ALL of the groups once it all drops anchor in a city near you. It's the old circus model. It's a proven, good show. Regional folks going to it every year when it comes to them.

It's gonna happen! It's a natural progression.

[Granny Smith]

The narcisissm (sp?) of those at the influential top (the Evil One and his BD lapdog) is appalling.

So if the G7 left and both DCI and the G7 go belly up, can we all finally agree that he killed drum corps??

Hopkins is the poster boy for this, but rest assured that Gibbs, et al are just as complicit in this as George. As has been said previously, this is not an overnight brain burp, but has been percolating for years.

In your mind, you need to have the same level of disdain for these other guys as you do for Hop.

Conversely, the directors from the other DCI member corps who BOLDLY pushed back and "rescued" DCI from these guys should be commended for their tough decisions to do what was right.

[ShortAndFast]

I'm fully prepared for flaming on my naivety, but I can't help but feel there must be something we're missing in all this. The more I read on this, yeah... it doesn't really look good for the activity as a whole and the smaller corps in particular.

What I can't come to terms with is why not one, not two, but SEVEN top corps are on board with this (for the most part at least). I could understand one or two selfishly greedy folks out there, but not a third of the World Class.

I think we can assume, because of so many corps, that there's more at stake here than ego or greediness or rules changes. Crown, for example, is a great beneficiary of the status quo - they are extremely popular, receive a ton of marketing exposure through DCI, and are likely to become the first new champion in a decade and a half. They'd have no incentive to join the G7 unless they were either (a) foolish or (b) convinced that the status quo was about to collapse.

I do not think that they are foolish - and yet, the news articles state that they were one of the originators of the idea.

So what does Kevin Smith know that we don't? My guess is he knows a lot more about the financial state of DCI and of various corps than we do.

[ecamburn]

Just to make sure the naiive perspective is represented...

Like many, my initial reaction to this news was that the G7 corps were greedy and selfish, and that if this proposal is implemented, that it would do significant harm to the activity.

BUT, do we really know enough yet to make these kinds of judgments? I'd like to hear more from G7 directors about why think this is fair, and why think this move would benefit the activity.

Could it be that there are economic issues at play that the public is not aware of? For example, could it be that in these economic times that the G7 corps are hurting financially, and that they feel they need extra revenue to survive?

Given the information that's currently out there, this doesn't smell right to me. But there could be a substantial backstory we're not aware of.

Edited May 21, 2010 by ecamburn

[BigBadMadMan]

Hopkins is the poster boy for this, but rest assured that Gibbs, et al are just as complicit in this as George. As has been said previously, this is not an overnight brain burp, but has been percolating for years.

In your mind, you need to have the same level of disdain for these other guys as you do for Hop.

Conversely, the directors from the other DCI member corps who BOLDLY pushed back and "rescued" DCI from these guys should be commended for their tough decisions to do what was right.

Oh, I mentioned Gibbs. ;-)

[GMichael1230]

Like many, my initial reaction to this news was that the G7 corps were greedy and selfish, and that if this proposal is implemented, that it would do significant harm to the activity.

BUT, do we really know enough yet to make these kinds of judgments? I'd like to hear more from G7 directors about why think this is fair, and why think this move would benefit the activity.

Could it be that there are economic issues at play that the public is not aware of? For example, could it be that in these economic times that the G7 corps are hurting financially, and that they feel they need extra revenue to survive?

Given the information that's currently out there, this doesn't smell right to me. But there could be a substantial backstory we're not aware of.

Wheres the extra revenue going to come from ? Why is it automatically assumed that if they perform, they will come........just becasue its DCP, doesnt mean it is not in some small way reflective of the general consensus..nobody likes greed, especially folks who support all of the corps and are struggling financially themselves in these tough economic times. Remember,many fans of the "g-7"marched somewhere else at one time.......they arent gonna just dismiss the rest of the drum corps world.

G

[Granny Smith]

I think we can assume, because of so many corps, that there's more at stake here than ego or greediness or rules changes. Crown, for example, is a great beneficiary of the status quo - they are extremely popular, receive a ton of marketing exposure through DCI, and are likely to become the first new champion in a decade and a half. They'd have no incentive to join the G7 unless they were either (a) foolish or (b) convinced that the status quo was about to collapse.

I do not think that they are foolish - and yet, the news articles state that they were one of the originators of the idea.

So what does Kevin Smith know that we don't? My guess is he knows a lot more about the financial state of DCI and of various corps than we do.

I think it began a little more simple and less sinister to this extent: These corps were in collusion together to try and use their muscle to restructure DCI to some degree. It was a power grab no matter how they try and spin it. You don't vote out Acheson without it being about power.

When the other member corps heard about this and took dramatic steps to push back I think it took the G7 corps by surprise and all of a sudden they were humiliated. These guys thought they would flex a little and everybody would acquiesce to their wishes. They were wrong. Instantly they were on the outside looking in. Egos raged and it has become an instant crisis for an activity we all hold dear.

[NakedEye]

I'm fully prepared for flaming on my naivety, but I can't help but feel there must be something we're missing in all this. The more I read on this, yeah... it doesn't really look good for the activity as a whole and the smaller corps in particular.

What I can't come to terms with is why not one, not two, but SEVEN top corps are on board with this (for the most part at least). I could understand one or two selfishly greedy folks out there, but not a third of the World Class.

I've always considered this a really noble activity. My brain right now can't process the idea that the heavy-hitters would go this route, endanger the activity and themselves, all for ego and money.

I mean, folks have horror stories about Hop, sure (not that I buy into them), but Fielder?? Gibbs?? Smith?? Valenzuela??

Really???

Exactly.

It is all well and fun to get the tar and feathers ready yet again for "That Dastardly George" tying all of drum corps to the railroad tracks, but that is not what's happening here. This is a serious proposal crafted by 7 sets of well-respected Directors, Administrative Teams, and most importantly complete Boards of Directors. That's a LOT of people involved, intelligent, experienced people (and ones who have no doubt been at odds with each other in the past) who care deeply about their own organizations and the activity as a whole. To create a detailed, 60-page explanation and then publicly stand by it by simultaneously posting a well-written PR about it to their official websites demonstrates way too much seriousness, complexity and professionalism to pass it all off as some egotistic, greedy power grab.

There are probably elements of it that could be labeled as such, but my feeling is there is a kernel of a good, carefully considered idea in the middle of all this that really can't be judged yet at this very early point. Perhaps it is The Biggest Disaster ever, but so supposedly was 3-valve bugles, Bb bugles, dancing in the color guard, amps, electronics and the budget of Star of Indiana.

I'm super interested in the fact that people have finally proposed a rethinking of a system that has seemed increasingly stale (and less financially beneficial) each year. That takes guts and it will be intriguing to see how the idea plays out/evolves.

[Fred Windish]

The entire Ambitious Seven concept will never get off the ground unless the current DCI participants allow its proponents to "toy" with their idea WITHIN the existing format for a couple of years. Without the current DCI, the Ambitious Seven are pretty much at Ground Zero, don't 'ya think?