BD vs Cadets in visual

[mellodramatic]

Nobody ever beats BD in visual. Especially field visual. Ever.

[crfrey71]

It does seem lately that the shows that win are 'spectacles'. See BD 09, 08, Phantom 08, Cavies 06, Cadets 05... Cadets 07 was a spectacle, and were a solid 2nd. Also see Crown 09. This year, see at least BD and Cadets.

"Spectacles" are a perfect description.

[dugada]

I don't hate them either. I don't pull for one corps over another based on the uniform.....I pull for individual shows over individual shows. There are years, I want BD to beat the pants of Cadets and Cavies (2006) and there are years, I want Cadets to smoke everyone (2005) and yes, even SCV gets some love (1999)

Dude, you have "Anybody but the Blue Devils" in your signature . I understand the whole rooting for the underdog thing but this kills your credibility. However I like your enthusiasm.

[cowtown]

hmmm, I thought this was obvious but don't see anyone else yet with my opinion so maybe I'm way off

2 things before I start, please forgive me if this sounds harsh, it's not meant to, but my internet tone often comes off that way

and

I like the Cadets show way, way better…even though it won't sound that way shortly

when I first saw the Cadets live, I couldn't get over how stale and borrowed their visuals looked. All their big visual GE moves we have seen before and to get credit for them they have to do them better than we have seen them before and as of yet, they don't

from the start in the Cadets block (cadets), to Jeffery…he is almost the same as their picnic man boy from that 90's show (cadets)…to hats on the field (Regiment) to running around the hats (BD chairs) to that rewind (Cavies machine) to running in a big circle (Crown last year), wind up key and even the entire toy solider concept (Guardsmen late 70s/early 80s..I think, might have been their winter guard but I know I've seen it before, just trouble placing it)

so it hits me like Crown 07 show did, a re-tread and for that I blame the book

BD is doing new, never before seen in DCI visuals (mirrors) they get more credit for it because it 'pushes the activity' (not something I always agree with but that's the way it is) plus it's easier to score high with a new visual because there is no previous comparison

I also think the guard in the same uniforms makes the corps look smaller, not bigger and as Jeffery's role grows, it will hurt them as its a distraction and the integration is forced, tacked on

plus I'll never emotionally connect with a man-boy, its way too telemundo, and more a representation of a character than a character… a small, child-like person would have been a better choice, IMO

the more I see Cadets show, the less I like it, jut like BD 06 hit me, it seems shallow and trite and I expect that will catch up with them at finals weeks as 3 views in a row will hurt

love the music though (SCV)

considering its the Cadets, this show i no way pushes the activity and DCI gives extra points for that but this is the most immediately accessible, what I would imagine to be most G-7 show, you get it on one viewing and you like it (I hope but to each their own)

so by the system in place, BD should score higher and they are

that said, I like this show, have no problems with most old style retreads and even almost prefer them

go Cadets

[saxfreq1128]

Try things that are drum corps. Just don't try wacky, crazy, off the wall stuff for the sake of it. Not even when VK did those shows back then, were they as crazy as this. They marched, played, and did drum corps very well. Same goes for Bridgemen.

Phantom's show in 2008 didn't have craziness??? Now, I liked it. But to be honest at the same time, it wasn't until they added more of the props, killings, herald trumpets, etc... did the show win. Sounds like a lot of craziness, as well. To be honest, BD's 2007 show probably had the least craziness of any winning show in recent years. What happened, people complained it was boring in the 2nd half of their show.

"Drum corps" in itself isn't wacky and crazy? People: it's grown folks tooting horns and tossing rifles with chickens on their heads. It is, has always been, will always be, a spectacle. The problem might just be that more shows as of late are so keen on reminding you of a property that's already there.

By the way... Didn't SCV win DCI with a Phantom of the Opera spectacle some 20+ years ago? Granted, it was a powerhouse show otherwise, but come on. The entire corps wore Phantom masks, and there was a magic trick. Honestly, I watch some shows from the 80s and think they'd fit in quite nicely with our tightrope walkers, samurai, and toy souldiers today. I mean that in a good way.

I absolutely see your point, but sometimes I wonder if people are too quick to call this a problem of the new century.

(And I wouldn't call Spartacus crazy, no. It had tons of characterization, but that only made it more emotionally consistent, IMO. I think it, Phenomenon of Cool, and 007, and even The Zone pt 1 were the most 'classic'/straightforward DCI winners last decade.)

[2000Cadet]

hmmm, I thought this was obvious but don't see anyone else yet with my opinion so maybe I'm way off

2 things before I start, please forgive me if this sounds harsh, it's not meant to, but my internet tone often comes off that way

and

I like the Cadets show way, way better…even though it won't sound that way shortly

when I first saw the Cadets live, I couldn't get over how stale and borrowed their visuals looked. All their big visual GE moves we have seen before and to get credit for them they have to do them better than we have seen them before and as of yet, they don't

from the start in the Cadets block (cadets), to Jeffery…he is almost the same as their picnic man boy from that 90's show (cadets)…to hats on the field (Regiment) to running around the hats (BD chairs) to that rewind (Cavies machine) to running in a big circle (Crown last year), wind up key and even the entire toy solider concept (Guardsmen late 70s/early 80s..I think, might have been their winter guard but I know I've seen it before, just trouble placing it)

so it hits me like Crown 07 show did, a re-tread and for that I blame the book

BD is doing new, never before seen in DCI visuals (mirrors) they get more credit for it because it 'pushes the activity' (not something I always agree with but that's the way it is) plus it's easier to score high with a new visual because there is no previous comparison

I also think the guard in the same uniforms makes the corps look smaller, not bigger and as Jeffery's role grows, it will hurt them as its a distraction and the integration is forced, tacked on

plus I'll never emotionally connect with a man-boy, its way too telemundo, and more a representation of a character than a character… a small, child-like person would have been a better choice, IMO

the more I see Cadets show, the less I like it, jut like BD 06 hit me, it seems shallow and trite and I expect that will catch up with them at finals weeks as 3 views in a row will hurt

love the music though (SCV)

considering its the Cadets, this show i no way pushes the activity and DCI gives extra points for that but this is the most immediately accessible, what I would imagine to be most G-7 show, you get it on one viewing and you like it (I hope but to each their own)

so by the system in place, BD should score higher and they are

that said, I like this show, have no problems with most old style retreads and even almost prefer them

go Cadets

Well seeing as how many people complained on how Cadets tried to "push" the activity in the past few years, I'd think the show this year would be a blessing. Guess not. To each his own.

It's a great show regardless of how shallow and trite people may think it is. And I doubt it'll catch up to them.

[cowtown]

Well seeing as how many people complained on how Cadets tried to "push" the activity in the past few years, I'd think the show this year would be a blessing. Guess not. To each his own.

It's a great show regardless of how shallow and trite people may think it is. And I doubt it'll catch up to them.

I knew that would happen

I like this show better than BD and in my world it would beat BD but we live in DCI's world

I think this is the best Cadets show since 2003

I'd rather a good show than a placement or number and this is a good show

[2000Cadet]

I knew that would happen

I like this show better than BD and in my world it would beat BD but we live in DCI's world

I think this is the best Cadets show since 2003

I'd rather a good show than a placement or number and this is a good show

I wasn't trying to belittle your opinion. Just responding to what I thought sounded a little harsh.

[decompressed]

Nobody ever beats BD in visual. Especially field visual. Ever.

Agreed.....as i have repeatedly said...the best visual technical program in the marching activity year in and year out.

[garfield]

As always, well written and wrong! And when you get that poll from your database on what fans see, please share it with the rest of us....until then.....it's your opinion (which is always informed and detailed).

I ask you to just keep this quote in mind from this thread: DCImonkey, "I actually LOVED the 2008 BD show, but I pulled against them at Finals just so we could see a new champ." That is perhaps the most honest and revealing comment on this thread. And more than anything explains how people view this competition...."through a glass" of their own desire.

You know, I enjoy going toe-to-toe with Plan9 because the thoughts are insightful, well-designed, and expressive, even if from the perspective of a BD Honk.

There's no misconception here of which corps gets my "favorite" vote.

But what Plan says here is the meat of the argument that he's consistently voiced over and over.

I think it has a lot of merit and I can understand the emotion on both sides.

But I just don't understand why it is that, because I'm glad PR won in '08 (not "beat Bd", but WON), and because I don't relate well to BDs music book, I'm a hater.

I don't recall thinking that I was glad PR beat BD, but I was thrilled that they won.

Many people don't relate to BD and love seeing a new winner. That doesn't mean we hate BD.

Now Monkey, on the other hand...