Pete Freedman Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 I now I personally appreciate everyone's thoughts on this. But can we at least TRY and have a decent conversation on dcp that doesn't get into our own personal thoughts and agendas. A fine drum corps is asking for help. And as far as "electronic costs" and all that, that's not really part of this equation or is very minimally. They've had their electronics through their sponsor Dynasty since they've had electronics. That's not what has caused this. I think the conversation is great as long as people don't trash the corps that's asking for help, especially based on the limited information given. I was hard on Stu earlier, but of course the issues he brings up are real issues. I've created a thread here that hopefully can divert the "financial management/mismanagement during tough times" debates to its own thread. All the other discussion seems fine here, and bumps the thread on a regular basis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 so...has the national touring model really helped? have all the recent rules changes really helped? when DCI, which is the member corps, vote these things in and we get great PR pieces touting how it will be the next best thing......yet I see nothing that proves it worked. DCI needs people on the board that aren't directors. too many egos in that room more worried about themselves, than the collective good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ma24le Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 So the money they are trying to raise...is this to get through the season or to help pay for back debts? Not sure if you noticed, but Glassmen have used various charter bus companies in recent years (usually corps stick with the same company). They dont use Penske for their trucks like most DCI corps, and they switched food vendors (most DCI corps use US Foods). Have they burned these bridges by being in so much debt to them? And receiving $550,000 seems very far fetched. I would love to see how they came up with that figure. Does that include the money DCI has given them for the past several years? I wish no ill meaning towards any corps, but for heaven's sake G-Men, get everything in order and start fresh. Pay off the debts and come out new and improved. Troopers did it..now follow their lead. Good luck to them! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeithHall Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 So now lets look at what it was BITD.... smaller circuits, less traveling, more regional. Save money? Probably. Is there a need for evry corps to tour the country from end of June till mid- August? DCM had it right! Drum Corps Est almost had it right. Maybe the old ways weren't so bad after all. Analyze this all you want but I still think the old ways were the best. I don't care about electronics or what key the instruments are in...what I do care about is maintaing what we have and growth. What are the present corps doing to encourage growth of the activity in their region? I ask the questions because I don't know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 (edited) It seems that some people wish to apply business ideas that work well for profit-driven companies. In DCI, the idea is to break even. Not to say that some of these ideas won't work and aren't valid, but if a corps can sustain the costs of traveling, then they shouldn't be penalized because others cannot. Each corps should find ways of meeting its own needs first and taking care of its own house. I could see where DCI could step in for certain situations to give a helping hand, but the corps must be responsible for themselves. And it's getting harder and harder to break even. It's nice that some corps are not having problems like this, but if more corps get deeper and deeper in doo-doo do we just continue on like we have and accept less corps? IMO the problem isn't that some corps are run less well as others, it's just that corps with deeper pockets are hit later. And what exactly can DCIs "helping hand" be? IMO this is starting to look like the mid 70s when gas prices tripled and lot of corps folded. But that was all due to bad management right? Who knows, maybe in 2040 people will say DC folded because of bad mangement too. Edited October 23, 2012 by JimF-LowBari Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cixelsyd Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 I now I personally appreciate everyone's thoughts on this. But can we at least TRY and have a decent conversation on dcp that doesn't get into our own personal thoughts and agendas. What if your personal agenda is balancing drum corps budgets? Not everything being said here is a personal agenda. I suggest, in this context, that a corps may need to cut costs to balance their budget, and that generally, DCI may need to consider rule and policy changes that lower the cost of competing at the highest levels. Costs have increased as the equipment has evolved. Personally, I like some of those changes - but if drum corps cannot afford them, something has to give. Of course, travel and touring costs have also increased over time, so maybe those costs can be reduced instead. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 It seems that some people wish to apply business ideas that work well for profit-driven companies. In DCI, the idea is to break even. In general, business models, goals, and ideas for non-profit and for-profit corporations should be the exact same, that being to profit as an entity. To "break even" as the goal standard is not a successful business model and should be unacceptable in any and every business (be them for-profit status or non-profit status); it is a formula for disaster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iplaytimpani Posted October 23, 2012 Author Share Posted October 23, 2012 I just meant this shouldn't turn into an electronics debate. That is not the issue here. And Glassmen have used different charter companies based on price and availability, not owed deficits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartans87 Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 So the money they are trying to raise...is this to get through the season or to help pay for back debts? Not sure if you noticed, but Glassmen have used various charter bus companies in recent years (usually corps stick with the same company). They dont use Penske for their trucks like most DCI corps, and they switched food vendors (most DCI corps use US Foods). Have they burned these bridges by being in so much debt to them? And receiving $550,000 seems very far fetched. I would love to see how they came up with that figure. Does that include the money DCI has given them for the past several years? I wish no ill meaning towards any corps, but for heaven's sake G-Men, get everything in order and start fresh. Pay off the debts and come out new and improved. Troopers did it..now follow their lead. Good luck to them! Well, speaking only to the statement in bold, if G-Men charge $2,500 for tour, times 150 kids, that is $375,000 right there. If they charge $3,000, that is $450,000 (and I have NO idea what they charge each member). Then add the fees they get from appearances, and it is not that far fetched to get to $550,000. Well, we give what we can, and get the word to friends who may be able to help as well, and see where they end up. Too bad they were not in the Chase Community Giving campaign recently. Would not have gotten $300,000, but would have made a dent if they had people rally around the cause. Spartans did a great job with marketing the event and received $50,000. I am sure Glassmen would love that right now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iplaytimpani Posted October 23, 2012 Author Share Posted October 23, 2012 I'll say it before someone else jumps on it and trys to turn it negative. They won money from chase a couple of years ago. I'm not involved with the finances of the corps but I have no doubt that money was used wisely and probably paid off some debt back then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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