George Dixon Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Well.... ehh... I personally think the pillows getting moved around the whole show are a complete waste of time/effort/effect Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjeffeory Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 (edited) OK, I am going to touch the subject everyone is afraid to talk about. What is "Clean" about the circles that Blue Devils make when they create the design of a movie camera? This design is done multiple times in the show and it has never been clean. I challenge anyone to show me a video this year of a clean circle form in that design. They make a clean circle when they wrap around the tables. However, the two circle film reels on the top of a camera design has never been clean on any of the Fan Network shows I have seen. We can all find "dirty" spots in any show from any corps. This is just an item that has been a problem for BD all year. Don't get me wrong. I love the show Blue Devils has put on the field this year. It deserves to be near or at the top. However, 2 points ahead of everyone (1.5 in Carolina on Sunday), is a little hard to understand. Cadets are showing how a clean white pants marching style can look amazing. Bluecoats are pulling the audience to their show like no one since 2008 Regiment. SCV is beautiful in design. Crown is challenging the barriers of space and sound (pun intended). Cavies have an artistic feel in their closer drill that brings memories of their championship years. All I can say, is that it is in the eyes and ears of the judges on the field and in the press box that put their "subjective" thoughts down on the sheets no matter what the sheets claim to be built on. Because the Blue Devils get credit for their impeccably clean individual marching technique and guard over everything else, where other corps don't get the same credit for their clean ensemble forms and velocity drill. It has been that way since the mid-90s and the influx of WGI judges. Edited July 29, 2014 by jjeffeory Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Because the Blue Devils get credit for their impeccably clean individual marching technique and guard over everything else, where other corps don't get the same credit for their clean ensemble forms and velocity drill. It has been that way since the mid-90s and the influx of WGI judges. But to be fair, I literally don't know of any visual person who knows what they're talking about who wouldn't say BD is consistently one of the best corps visually. They march better than anyone, and if one or two obvious forms are a little dirty (and rotating circles = pretty difficult to clean), it doesn't detract from the rest of their amazing visual production. Even when Cavaliers were at their visual peak during their dynasty years, it was no Vis cakewalk against the Blue Devils. During the 2000-2002, 2004, 2006 Championship Cavalier productions, the Vis breakdown was: * 2000 - won overall Vis. (won 2/3 captions with BD winning the other) * 2001 - TIED overall Vis. with BD (won 2/3 captions with BD winning the other) * 2002 - won all Vis. captions * 2004 - BD won Vis (Cavaliers won 1 of the Vis. captions) * 2006 - won overall Vis (won 2/3 w/BD winning the other) Blue Devils are outstanding visually, and really have been since their overhaul in 1994. To try to explain it away with influx of WGI judges, or whatnot detracts from their awesome visual performance. You can argue design (which I'm not), but they perform the snot out of their visual book consistently Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Don't get me wrong. I love the show Blue Devils has put on the field this year. It deserves to be near or at the top. However, 2 points ahead of everyone (1.5 in Carolina on Sunday), is a little hard to understand. Cadets are showing how a clean white pants marching style can look amazing. Bluecoats are pulling the audience to their show like no one since 2008 Regiment. SCV is beautiful in design. Crown is challenging the barriers of space and sound (pun intended). Cavies have an artistic feel in their closer drill that brings memories of their championship years. All I can say, is that it is in the eyes and ears of the judges on the field and in the press box that put their "subjective" thoughts down on the sheets no matter what the sheets claim to be built on. 1. Cadets have some pretty big content issues, both musically and visually (mostly, IMO, musically). I think they have the type of design that you either love and accept its faults, or you dislike and the faults become amplified. They perform well, but their problems seem to be design. That being said, their performance keeps them in 2nd; I personally really like their show, more so than I thought I would. It's come a long way over the course of the season, and I can't wait to see it Finals week!! 2. Obviously the Bluecoats comment is argumentative, and I would say Cadets 2011 and Crown last year also pulled the audience in like crazy (especially Crown last year). Bluecoats are having some substantial visual issues (relative to 1st place) from a performance standpoint, and also haven't gotten their brass up to the caliber of BD, Crown, and Cadets. Again, they're a great corps, but so are Cadets and BD. It's always amusing when people seemingly forget that shows are generally not ranked based on the overall show: they are broken down by several captions, with each judge having a narrow scope on which to rank/rate. As a percussion guy, I could watch SCV all day and love their percussion section and maybe overlook some of their design or visual performance problems: just like the percussion judge doesn't care what is going on visually with the corps. The vis. judges could care less how a corps sounds or plays and is only looking at how the corps moves in relation to criteria on the sheet. I've talked to judges who had a corps up and they've told me stuff to the effect of, "I personally don't like that show, but it is maxing out the sheets and I have to give it up for that." Or even stuff like, "I love that show, but they're not performing as well as this other group so I can't give em credit." People look at scores in relationship to how much they personally enjoyed or appreciated the show, but that's not how judging criteria & ranking/rating work 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Corps Guy Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 It's always amusing when people seemingly forget that shows are generally not ranked based on the overall show: they are broken down by several captions, with each judge having a narrow scope on which to rank/rate. As a percussion guy, I could watch SCV all day and love their percussion section and maybe overlook some of their design or visual performance problems: just like the percussion judge doesn't care what is going on visually with the corps. The vis. judges could care less how a corps sounds or plays and is only looking at how the corps moves in relation to criteria on the sheet. I've talked to judges who had a corps up and they've told me stuff to the effect of, "I personally don't like that show, but it is maxing out the sheets and I have to give it up for that." Or even stuff like, "I love that show, but they're not performing as well as this other group so I can't give em credit." People look at scores in relationship to how much they personally enjoyed or appreciated the show, but that's not how judging criteria & ranking/rating work Please understand, it is not my intent to slam any given corps. In fact, you will see that I actually compliment every single corps I mentioned. The top 5/6 corps are amazing this year and each of them bring their own strengths to the field. However, judging is always subjective. Whether we are talking about drum corps, gymnastics or the X-Games, judging is subjective with guidelines. The guidelines this year includes the audience. Some judges are taking this at it's word while others may be taking it as a suggestion. I truly respect the judges and take their feedback to heart. Even when I disagree with judges I speak to on the marching band side, I still learn from them and respect the hard task that they take on. My main comment is that I find it challenging to accept that one corps is almost 2 points ahead of the field. I love the Blue Devils and if you look at my profile, you will see they are one of my favorite corps. I just don't see that big of a spread this late in the year. Then again, I am old and may not have a clue........... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 When I heard in the offseason that SCV was going to do Sheriffs Yard again for themselves, I winced. But this Sheriff's Yard seems much nicer. They just need to clean it up a bit more now, imo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bannedforlife Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 I am not kidding.... Why is SCV not in first place?!?!?!?! This is the most heart wrenching beautiful. show ever done on a field yet it's barely scratching 3rd? NO wAY HOSER! Your tilted opinion is so out of this world it's like using an American portrait to describe a Fellini movie. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Other Mike Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Except he left off, "relatively filthy both visually and musically compared to Top 3, let alone Blue Devils," as well as, "has a fairly myopic level of effect that doesn't really come close to the depth of Blue Devils, Cadets, Bluecoats, or Crown." Maybe that will change as they clean, but that BS lack-of-understanding of how to read a recap that the other mike posted, while humorously facetious, is, well, lacking any sort of understanding. Even just a glance at the Atlanta recap will give a pretty good idea of why SCV is sitting 5th. Also, as others have mentioned, this is an amazing year of great shows & talented corps: one of the better Top 5's that I can think of in a long time! Being great only moves you up the ranks if you're greater than everyone else, but this year BD, Cadets, Bluecoats, Crown are all currently greater than SCV (Crown has cleaned up a bit since I saw them a week or two ago) Lighten up Francis your Capt. Obvious uniform is on a little too tight It's just marching band THIS is why we can't have light-hearted conversations anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Other Mike Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 ehh... I personally think the pillows getting moved around the whole show are a complete waste of time/effort/effect I agree, sorta like creating DCP when RAMD was around < raises flame shields > 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cappybara Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 (edited) I agree, sorta like creating DCP when RAMD was around < raises flame shields > If you're going for a humorous persona, you might want to take an approach more similar to a user named "skevinp." You'll get more laughs Edited July 29, 2014 by Cappybara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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