Shempy Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 You are beginning to sound like Channel 3, ha, he. Them's fightin' words! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tobias Posted February 3, 2016 Author Share Posted February 3, 2016 (edited) I'm going to make a minor pick after listening to this arrangement of Pines. Overall, I love it and it even has a characteristic signature last-three-count resolution that you can hear as "Cadets" from outside the stadium. But here's my pick: It builds too fast. Respighi was depicting the footfalls of the Roman soldiers from far away, as they slowly made their way back to Rome after conquests. The original takes a LOT longer to build the tension of those boots, and the trumpeting of the victorious is much more brash, with the 8th note triplets driving stronger and with more determination than what Cadets portray it in this arrangement. The original would take all of the show's time limit to unfold, and I get that, but the miracle arrangers at Cadets can't lose in translation one of key concepts of the original's intent. I'm thrilled that Cadets are doing Pines (only Phantom would do it better, IMO) and it will be interesting to see how this "Victorious Proclamation" is used with the rest of the show. All IMO, of course. Question, does a brass judge penalize a trumpet line that is brash in its approach to a certain musical passage even though it's done for effect purposes or is it recognized in the scope of what's going on in the show? Not sure if caption judges are holistic or myopic in their assessment of performance and technique. Edited February 3, 2016 by Tobias Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 (edited) Question, does a brass judge penalize a trumpet line that is brash in its approach to a certain musical passage even though it's done for effect purposes or is it recognized in the scope of what's going on in the show? Not sure if caption judges are holistic or myopic in their assessment of performance and technique. If so, then a full corpus of Charles Ives music would be hurting. Star of Indiana did one of his pieces in their Americana show. Might be a good reference point. Just thought also of the NY Skyliners when they were from Yonkers and all the times they mimicked NYC traffic noises via their horns. In fact, Cadets even played some New York traffic in various pieces of On the Town over the years. Edited February 3, 2016 by xandandl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 Unless it's not important to the concept/theme they're shooting for. Assuming they're still on "statues coming to life" thing, I'm not sure conveying a Roman military procession is necessary. The commonality in "Stoned" and Pines is Rome. This is going to be a show about Rome, I'm sure. And if they do Rome, even Roman statues, or even stoned Romans, they should be cautious of telling a completely different tale of Pines than was intended in the original. I'm pretty sure Pines is a lot less obscure to most people than was K-Pop or Fellini. But that's probably just me being a geek. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdaddy Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 The commonality in "Stoned" and Pines is Rome. This is going to be a show about Rome, I'm sure. And if they do Rome, even Roman statues, or even stoned Romans, they should be cautious of telling a completely different tale of Pines than was intended in the original. I'm pretty sure Pines is a lot less obscure to most people than was K-Pop or Fellini. But that's probably just me being a geek. Disagreed. How many folks even know that Respighi meant for the fourth movement to represent Roman soldiers marching down Via Appia? I suspect few. Drum corps design, to me, is all about programming for moods. Designers pick music that fits that mood, then arrange it to better fit the mood. A couple recent examples to me of where the original tune seemed to be an odd fit (and certainly away from the original intent of the composer) but was transformed to fit the mood: Crown's use of Sensemaya in 2009 and Copland's Organ Symphony in 2015. Especially Sensemaya, as it lost much of its latin feel in 2009, but it worked. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quad Aces Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 Disagreed. How many folks even know that Respighi meant for the fourth movement to represent Roman soldiers marching down Via Appia? I suspect few. It depends upon your definition of "folks". If we are talking about someone that is a fairly-involved band or orchestra student/member/fan (and not necessarily an expert in ether genre), then I am pretty sure they will know the meaning of the fourth movement. Pines is one of the more mainstream orchestral pieces - a la "The Planets", "Pictures at an Exhibition", etc. - which is pretty well-known to even the non-diehard orchestra goer. If we are taking about a non-music person or a member of the general public, not only will the meaning of the fourth movement be lost on them, but probably anything else that they hear at a drum corps show as well. BTW, I'm not disagreeing with the rest of your post - just wanted to comment on the above. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeN Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 It depends upon your definition of "folks". If we are talking about someone that is a fairly-involved band or orchestra student/member/fan (and not necessarily an expert in ether genre), then I am pretty sure they will know the meaning of the fourth movement. Pines is one of the more mainstream orchestral pieces - a la "The Planets", "Pictures at an Exhibition", etc. - which is pretty well-known to even the non-diehard orchestra goer. If we are taking about a non-music person or a member of the general public, not only will the meaning of the fourth movement be lost on them, but probably anything else that they hear at a drum corps show as well. BTW, I'm not disagreeing with the rest of your post - just wanted to comment on the above. Actually, I had no idea that's what it was about. Makes more sense now. Also makes me wonder why nobody ever tried it with the marching-sound-by-wood-feet-table thing that pits sometimes use. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdaddy Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 It depends upon your definition of "folks". If we are talking about someone that is a fairly-involved band or orchestra student/member/fan (and not necessarily an expert in ether genre), then I am pretty sure they will know the meaning of the fourth movement. Pines is one of the more mainstream orchestral pieces - a la "The Planets", "Pictures at an Exhibition", etc. - which is pretty well-known to even the non-diehard orchestra goer. If we are taking about a non-music person or a member of the general public, not only will the meaning of the fourth movement be lost on them, but probably anything else that they hear at a drum corps show as well. BTW, I'm not disagreeing with the rest of your post - just wanted to comment on the above. I'm by no means a music expert, but I listen to classical music for hours a day while working and regularly attend orchestra concerts. I've seen Pines of Rome performed live three times, with a fourth coming tomorrow with the NY Phil. I'd never heard of or read about the fourth movement representing the march of soldiers until researching a trip to Rome a couple months ago (while listening to Pines on repeat all the while). I guess we just pick up tidbits unless we're actively looking into this stuff. Perhaps I'm an exception as a drum corps nerd (emphasis on nerd). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tobias Posted February 3, 2016 Author Share Posted February 3, 2016 Disagreed. How many folks even know that Respighi meant for the fourth movement to represent Roman soldiers marching down Via Appia? I suspect few. Drum corps design, to me, is all about programming for moods. Designers pick music that fits that mood, then arrange it to better fit the mood. A couple recent examples to me of where the original tune seemed to be an odd fit (and certainly away from the original intent of the composer) but was transformed to fit the mood: Crown's use of Sensemaya in 2009 and Copland's Organ Symphony in 2015. Especially Sensemaya, as it lost much of its latin feel in 2009, but it worked. I think the judges who tend to be music educators, will understand the premise of the musical selections and how well it's being interpreted or used to convey a conceptX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 (edited) I'm going to make a minor pick after listening to this arrangement of Pines. Overall, I love it and it even has a characteristic signature last-three-count resolution that you can hear as "Cadets" from outside the stadium. But here's my pick: It builds too fast. I agree with you. I love Pines of Rome ever since I heard the '82 Cavies play it. I am not concerned that much with the intent of the piece and relate more to it just being great, inspirational music. With that in mind, the Cadets/GH? released a clip a couple of camps back that had a much longer version. It was really wonderful to the point where I didn't want it to end. I wish it was longer because the Cadets horn line brings a lot of life to it. Edited February 3, 2016 by Fish 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.