Blue Devils 2016

[cowtown]

BD is a victim of their own success and their own spin or, um, designs explanations. They added one strip on their leg for 2006 and said it was for the God Father theme, logo (puppet string) and then it returned. They added the high plume and half-leg cape in 2008 in said it was to be absurd and it returned. They added the contra’s doing a monkey dance in 2009 and said it was from a 30’s art film and then it returned. They added the box on the shako in 2014 and said it was a movie projector….after all these little adds and their justifications and still keeping them, they no longer make sense. They just look BD which is cool but they are no longer original and not very creative

[DCI-86]

I think it's a symptom of the same key design staff in the driving seat for years. James Logan won scholastic world st WGI about 10 times and in the end one show merged into the next due to the same design staff throughout that period.

[DrumManTx]

Start your own hate thread. Even though you show is cheesy a/f I don't go on those threads.

?

So first of all you need to actually quote people so we know who you are talking to.

2nd, your show? I'm not an alum or an MM do I don't have a show.

3rd, never said anything was cheesy, or anyone else from what I can see.

4th, I didn't realize this wasn't a discussion forum. Where we can discuss things. No one is keeping you from making your opinion known on other shows. That is more than welcome. Though you might want to try something other than "cheesy af" if you want to be taken seriously.

[dcsnare93]

I don't see how Crown or Bluecoats are any less "stale" or "formulaic" than BD, we must be watching different shows. If anything, I can see, to a large extent, elements of things each of these corps have used in previous seasons. If you just don't like their style of doing things, no problem. There's 20+ other corps to enjoy.

[DrumManTx]

I don't see how Crown or Bluecoats are any less "stale" or "formulaic" than BD, we must be watching different shows. If anything, I can see, to a large extent, elements of things each of these corps have used in previous seasons. If you just don't like their style of doing things, no problem. There's 20+ other corps to enjoy.

I never said they were not formulaic too. Now you're just putting words in my mouth, or in this case a lack of them.

Bluecoats DEFINITELY are using a formula. I just feel like what they did in how they combined everything this year is more risky. The uniforms and the visual package for Bluecoats are the element I was talking about with BDs shows in the past few years that I feel like they didn't go for this year.

I already said for me it's a personal taste thing if you read my posts about BD this year.

Edited July 28, 2016 by DrumManTx

[Cappybara]

pretty much the first thing, number 1 on GE visual, last line; Creativity, originality

https://issuu.com/drumcorpsinternational/docs/2012_judging_sheets_full_set

Thank you, good to see actual evidence rather than speculation.

Now, what's to say BD ISNT being creative and original? Just because their usual basic framework is in place does not mean they aren't being creative.

Streamers on flags, creative costuming (they may not be appealing to the eye, but who would have thought to put Shakespeare's mug on the back of a guard uni?), guard twirling without being able to see anything, large tarp to mimic an ocean wave.

No corps is completely reinventing DCI. Even the Bluecoats are following a framework, but all corps are making their own small additions that are creative and original

[Cappybara]

Well, how would you define leadership? Because it sounds to me you are saying, leaders win on the sheets. Period.

And I have no issue with winning on the sheets. In fact, I have been criticized as defining succeeding as winning by the sheets.

But I, personally, don't automatically conclude that whomever won the gold is leading the evolution of the idiom. In anything.

Blue devils doesn't have to change much of anything to outscore just about everyone for the next decade. But I for one would hope, and expect, that they would WANT to evolve their creative vision, if only because they can.

Blue Devils literally changed the entire direction of DCI by redefining the role of guard in the activity. And they did that not through political actions, or grandstanding, but by simply doing it on the field and doing it at the highest possible level of execution and creativity. And note I used those two words together, because I believe that is what BD did. They out executed, AND out created, the entire field.

Now, there are at least two other corps doing what they did a decade ago, by challenging the boundaries of what a drum corps show is. Why, if you COULD be the definer of the future of drum corps, would you simply choose to score more points than the next guy? That, to me, is what Leadeship is all about.

Why do you need to redefine a medium to be a leader? By your definition, no one is a leader

[Cappybara]

I don't see how Crown or Bluecoats are any less "stale" or "formulaic" than BD, we must be watching different shows. If anything, I can see, to a large extent, elements of things each of these corps have used in previous seasons. If you just don't like their style of doing things, no problem. There's 20+ other corps to enjoy.

Exactly. Crown uses the same old major chords, same minor changes to their uniform like BD, same body movement, same "the world is happy and awesome" closer, etc

I give the Bluecoats a bit of a pass because they've been doing some truly innovative things with soundscapes on the field with their speaker placements and now pit placements (you could say Bluecoats are also redefining the standards of decency for DCI uniforms, but I don't say that as a good thing). Otherwise, the Bluecoats have some very similar concepts. This show and Tilt aren't as different as they may first appear.

Edited July 28, 2016 by Cappybara

[cowtown]

I don't see how Crown or Bluecoats are any less "stale" or "formulaic" than BD, we must be watching different shows. If anything, I can see, to a large extent, elements of things each of these corps have used in previous seasons. If you just don't like their style of doing things, no problem. There's 20+ other corps to enjoy.

I’ll take a stab at this

Crown has a traditional drum corps show this year but within that context, the left to right movement of the corps as lead by the stage coach across the field is fresh but even more so, their visual body work is cowboy style this year where as last year it was devil style. They adjusted their individual visual repertoire of the horn line to better support the show theme. Since the show theme is different from last year, it becomes original and creative. This is not the case for Blue Devils this year as a lot of their visuals and GE points are rehashed, BD stock moves, therefore they become less original and less creative (stale). Crown’s show has a similar arc to last year but these 2 years are a departure for them, as were the 2 years prior. Crown in 2012 was stale; it was the end of their 2007-12 period which was played out, how many times do we want to see a bug squash?

Bluecoats have unique visuals that are built around the props, ones we haven’t seen before so it’s original and creative. They also have a new sense of staging with multiple points transitioning by visual movements and GE grabs built around the props. It’s very show specific. Plus the color of the props are mixed into the overall color scheme, design palette so it looks fresh compared to BD typical white prop boat. BD did add color to the panels this year but so far it’s a negative. Bluecoats show follows a progression, the bleachers from 2013 combined with the ramps from 2014 but the combination is still fresh, new, original and creative.

Watching DCI for a number of years, you start to notice things; sometimes a corps has a big jump in the ranks then does a copycat show and drops, the staleness (lack of originality and creativity) catches up to them. I’m inclined to think Bluecoats have the winning design in DCI this year. Personally, it’s not my favorite nor do I think it’s the best but I do think it’s the one that has the most reward potential within DCI’s current system and directional push.

There are a lot of shows I enjoy that have massive flaws; BD is only under such scrutiny because they are in the top tier, as it should be when every .1 counts

[GUARDLING]

Thank you, good to see actual evidence rather than speculation.

Now, what's to say BD ISNT being creative and original? Just because their usual basic framework is in place does not mean they aren't being creative.

Streamers on flags, creative costuming (they may not be appealing to the eye, but who would have thought to put Shakespeare's mug on the back of a guard uni?), guard twirling without being able to see anything, large tarp to mimic an ocean wave.

No corps is completely reinventing DCI. Even the Bluecoats are following a framework, but all corps are making their own small additions that are creative and original

Often at the top, in any part of activity, it is not just to be different BUT to set a new standard. Setting a new standard doesn't have to mean new BUT how something is done. It is true things like streamers on equipment is not new at all , as a matter a fact we fought in the late 80s for everyone to finally get rid of them. Guards who continued to use them were laughed at for at least a decade till they disappeared. Old can also be new again and set a new standard for the times. Same goes for tarps, nothing new BUT newly used , well you all can debate that if you want.

Something new can certainly set a new standard in the activity BUT something reworked to make it look fresh and new can also set new standards. Now of course the later can be a harder sell or harder to do imo but for some designers they welcome reworking something and bringing it into the present. In this respect BD over the years have done this with outstanding skills.

Edited July 28, 2016 by GUARDLING