jwillis35

1. Bluecoats 2. Cadets 3. Phantom Regiment

I will be there as well. Will likely twitter some comments. @willisje Should be a good one in Columbus. Go Blooooo!

I don't know him, and I would have no clue how he has been doing with SCV, but my feeling is that he is working his tail end off and making a huge difference. Anyone who puts in long hours and deals with the constant struggles of keeping a drum and bugle corps alive is doing a great service to our activity. I highly doubt winning is the ultimate goal. It is nice, and they are certainly striving for it, but if your only definition for his success, and that of the corps, is winning, then it becomes difficult to be realistic and to put the focus on the more important objectives. Also, just my opinion, but what your corps did in the 70s and 80s has no bearing on today. Great for history, yes. But as it stands, SCV has not exactly been a contender all that much since 1990 (the last 20 years). Take out 1998 and 1999 and there are plenty of amazing Vanguard shows, but not title shows. Does that make them less successful over the past 20 years? Gosh I hope not. But if your only goal is for them to win titles, then I guess they are 1 - 19. Who wants to look at it that way? The real record: classy organization, great shows, excellent membership and community service and outreach, and they manage their assets as well as anyone in the business. NOW...that is successful!

When DCI began using the build-up system in 1984, you could make the argument that points were no only awarded, but were easier to come by. Scores have, in general been higher since that point in time. These shows we see today that are scoring in the low 80s would likely score in the low 70s under the tic system from 1972 to 1983. I don't know if I would call that score inflation, but clearly the points have been easier to come by and we have seen some amazingly high scores come finals. Now some of this will change, as others have mentioned, when we get a full judging panel in place. As some have noted, the actual score is not as important as the spread between the competitors. Example: one set of judges may score corps X and Y in the low 80s, with corps X at an 83.1 and corps Y at an 82.1. Two days later the same two corps meet, but different judging panel. This judging panel has X at 81.5 and Y at 80.1. The real difference here is not that scores went down, but that there was a variance of .4 on the spread. At show 1 corps Y was only 1 point behind. At show 2 corps Y was 1.4 behind. This is what you want to watch over the course of the season. It can be cruel at times. A corps that places near the bottom may feel they deserve a score that reflects their efforts, and they feel strongly that they are in the 70 percentile of handling their show. In a 100-point system that means they feel they should be in the 70s, but when BD or Cadets are only in the low 70s also (early season), then the comparative analysis puts the other corps in the 60s or lower. Why? Competition. You chose to compete against these powerful corps and therefore no matter HOW good you get you will get dumped to some degree because the GOAL is to pick a winner and assign placements according to BEST. It's not a feel-good story. Although drum corps judges must use both methods of ranking and rating, the main goal is to RANK. That is the goal of any competition. In NASCAR, if Jimmy Johnson has a great run, one of his best in a while, he can feel good about that, yes...but none of that will matter much if he still places 22nd.

If this happens at all, and it's not supposed to, it would be during the early stages of the competitive season. The "shock" or surprise of seeing a corps that has been down take the field with a much better product and performance can initially bring a nice result. As the season progresses, a fair and more competitive approach takes place. After all, it is a competition. The point of the score is to reflect placement (ranking) and competency (rating). Ranking requires that a judge compare the contestants abilities in order to place them appropriately amongst their competitors. Rating requires that the judge assign value (a number) to a specific content area that reflects the corps abilities and deficiencies. The process is really not easy, so I definitely feel for judges. But as you can see, it would be difficult for a judge to just assign numbers based on how much they like a corps or how good they feel about the show.

Could be. Very hard to say because comparing night to night is so hard when the lineup changes. My guess is no, they are not there with Cadets, Crown, Bluecoats, and BD just yet. I am sure they could be soon, so that is the fun part of competition over a long sustained period, like an entire summer. Things will change. In terms of head to head and spreads however, they were 2.2 points (or something like that) behind the Cadets just last night, and have been behind the Cadets by a similar margin for sometime now. I tend to put a bit more stock in the spreads and not so much the score. Bluecoats were 3 points behind Crown when they first met, then the 2nd meeting they were only .6 behind (I think), and to me that is more telling, not what the actual score was, but the differential between the corps.

I know I was blown away when I saw them live. Always like their shows, but I love this show!

Best thing I have read in a while. Love it, and LOLWROTG!

This is a good point. I have attended shows with plenty of music professors, myself being one, and we are often puzzled at the credit some corps get for choppy musical arrangements that don't make sense, and that lack any sense of direction. Telling me that the music is coordinated with the drill only means that you are willing to sacrifice one for the other. This is not a good trade-off. Both are important. This is why I propose what I did a few posts back. That we re-define GE and put music and visual under one roof (one judge). My GE Definitions: The music must be effectively constructed and well coordinated. The visual must be effectively constructed and well coordinated. The music and visual must work together and be blended/coordinated in a manner that is logical, artistic, and meaningful in regard to the show's themes or concepts. Finally, how does this coordinated effect between music and visual affect the customer (audience)? The show must reach the customer. Demand, content in construction, performance levels...all of that is judged in the performance captions. In fact, I might be inclined to setup a judging system using only two main content areas: 1) Performance Captions, 2) General Effect. get rid of visual. Here is how this could work. Performance Captions: Brass, Percussion, Guard, and Marching(M&M). - Each caption (except one) has 3 elements: Tech(technique), Comp(Composition/Construction), and Perf(Performance). - Marching(M&M) would only have two elements: Tech & Perf, - 4 judges needed for early season shows - 7 judges are used for regional shows and Finals (2 for brass, percussion, and guard, and one for marching. When 2 judges are used, one judges performance only and the other judges assess tech/comp) General Effect: Effectiveness of Total Show - 1 judge needed for all shows (using all the definitions set forth above or in my other post) - caption elements are Music, Visual, Coordination, Audience Scoring = Performance (60 points) and GE (40 points) Breakdown = Performance: Brass Tech(10) Comp(10) Perf(10) / 2 = total score. Same for Percussion and Guard. Marching(M&M): Tech(15) Perf(15) / 2 = total score. - so each performance caption breaks down to 15 total points per, or 60 total points. GE: Music(10) Visual(10) Coordination (10) Audience (10)

Some great stuff. I don't think the system is broken or even in need of major repair. By and large it does produce good results, and with the exception of a few corps here and there, I think the results are fairly accurate. To me, there is ONE BIG area to look at, and that is General Effect. It's not that we have the caption, and I am fine with its total percentage of the score, but it's a) how we define it, b) how we judge to that definition, and c) who should judge it. As of now we have a GE visual score and a GE music score, but I see the whole thing as one, judged by one person. You could make the case that it should be 30 points instead of 40, and I'd be fine with that, but I see the whole thing as one BIG picture. To me, GE is: - effective and logical drill - effective and logical music - the combination of music and drill in a manner that is well coordinated and helps sustain the show and present it's concepts and themes in the best possible way. - the ability to reach the audience and to entertain the customer - the ability to do these things with clarity, precision, and confidence A good judge can do this. He doesn't need to be an expert on drill design to figure out that the drill is outstanding and really well coordinated. Same thing is true of the music. And a trained judge can tell when those two are coordinated, reaching the audience, and if the precision is there and to what degree. The clause about the customer is important.

Thanks, Bob. The review was great. It was YOUR opinion, not that of someone else. Those who like to criticize reviews must remember that they are lashing out at how someone else feels. Yes, you have a right to say what's on your mind, so write your own review. We don't have enough people doing that. If I disagree with someone I will just present it like that. That's always better than accusing them of being negative or only liking a certain corps. Just my 2 cents.

Way to go BLOOOOO! Wow, that show is definitely shaping up to be top 5, maybe top 3. Love it. I have not seen Crown live, but from FN they look amazing to me, and I have seen Bluecoats live (once) and they also looked amazing to me. Probably their best show in a while. The race for top 5 is going to be unreal this year. We say that a lot I guess, but this year really seems true. And I have seen Phantom as well, and that show will pack a serious punch when all the pieces are cleaned and tweaked a bit. This all gets really interesting when Blue Devils and SCV head east.

I do expect Bluecoats to cut the gap between them and Crown. Maybe they can come out on top. That would be something. I hope all the corps kick butt tonight.

Just for some quick edification: Crown and Bluecoats have already competed this year, so this is not the first head to head. They met in Charleston, WV. 1 Carolina Crown 76.600 2 The Cadets 75.800 3 Bluecoats 73.600 4 Phantom Regiment 73.500 5 Glassmen 70.300 6 Spirit 67.000 7 Teal Sound 63.300

Yeah, I get what you're saying. But I think you know what I meant. Sure, big corporations can certainly impose their will on government through lobbyists and financial support to campaigns, etc., but in reality they also must obey the law and work within the framework set forth in the constitution controlled by our government. What is DCI's constitution? I think that is what I am asking. I just don't think the model we operate under is working. It's more the tail wagging the dog. The big corporations are saying that the smaller ones are not important, that less is more. Perhaps they wish to buy all the smaller corporations, and this will continue until they start eating each other, and then there will be ONE...the BlueDetSCVtomCoats.

I think it would be great if the "roundtable" discussions do happen. Here are some questions I would present: 1. How sustainable is the model for running a drum & bugle corps when most of their members are not from the locale or region? It seems to me that the top corps can get away with it due to their popularity and placement, but I don't see the same success in recruiting and retention of members with other corps. Has the national tour and the need to copy the top corps made it difficult for other units to prosper? 2. Is it impossible for DCI to develop a regional tour from mid June to July 5 in order to allow the corps to have more local show opportunities and to give them more time to develop an awareness within their community and region? I use the July 5 date primarily because I think all these corps should be in their hometowns, or regions, for July 4 parades and concerts. Americans like to support things that are "homegrown." We take pride in that. But drum corps just do not give us much of an opportunity to build this kind of local/regional base of fans and supporters. 3. The G7 has caused quite a stir. None of us knows how this will evolve and what will eventually come from this proposal. If a split occurs, how does the G7 plan to market such a small collection of corps and can they succeed considering the travel it will take for these corps to meet up and compete? To me, DCI would have the decided advantage. 4. We often hear about proposals for change to the activity. Certainly George Hopkins gets blasted for his ideas and his proposals, and while I don't agree with some of his ideas I do believe the man has a right to express himself and has done some fabulous work for his corps. No doubt he works hard to keep the Cadets alive. Dave Gibbs also gets blasted from time to time for the same reasons, and he has also done fabulous work for his corps. Those two directors seem to be at the forefront, and we have discussed many of their ideas to a point of frustration. However, are there proposals or ideas out there that are aimed at preserving the historical aspects of the American Drum & Bugle Corps? Has any thought been given to going back to 2-valve G brass, the need for a less subjective TICK system of judging, getting rid of narration, amps, electronics, going back to 128 members as a max, or anything like this? Most of what we hear seems to be leading the activity toward a blend of elements that look and sound more like marching band. 5. I believe DCI should be a corporation that is run by DCI, not the corps. Perhaps in 1972, when DCI was founded as an Association governed BY the corps, this was a good model; but I believe this model to be backwards for the governance of competition and the betterment of international drum & bugle corps. If we were only looking to preserve the betterment of the top corps, then such self governance would be fine (kind of like letting IBM, Apple, Microsoft, Exxon, GE, Intel, Cisco, and GM control our government). DCI is the government and needs to be re-structured that way to help preserve the future of this activity. What do you think about that, and if possible how might this be achieved? Just a few.

I thought there 2009 show was great as well. The last two years have been what, I think, a lot of folks want to see in Cadets. A nice mix of old and new, some innovative ideas, but mostly just great, in-your-face drum corps. This year's show is a bit better integrated and flows with better continuity. Should be a stunner come finals. Cadets from 2004 to 2008 just didn't do it. 2005 was a talented bunch that performed the heck out of that show, but not my cup of tea. There are many that love that show, and I respect that. 04 was ok, 06 was a disaster (jmo), 07 was much like 05 but with narration. That corps could absolutely perform, and may have been the best corps on the field, but the narration I believe cost them. 08 was also too much narration, and too many changes. So the last 2 years have been nice to see.

I agree with G. Star of Indiana should have won the title, IMO, in 1991, 1992, and 1993. I loved Cavaliers show in 92, but not a title show. Loved Cadets in 93, but not clean enough. Now that aside, if this year's SCV show is like Star 1993--and I just watched it on FN and do find many similarities, and not just with music--then we must remember that Star 93 was not exactly accepted at the beginning of that season. They were even booed at shows, or scores would be booed. I remember the rage on RAMD and the debates that were taking place after shows and in the stadium after scores. So today we fondly look back at that show and with 20/20 vision see the genius and performance excellence that we were all witness to. But often you don't see those things in the HEAT OF THE MOMENT (I love ASIA). Ok, bad joke. :-) The only thing I took away from my first viewing of them [star 93] was that they were really talented and had a show that was cutting edge. I didn't like all of it yet. I wasn't getting the total effect. By season's end I respected it greatly, and enjoyed some moments. A few years later I thought to myself "that was a one-of-a-kind show." This will be the case for many that see SCV this year. It will take a read or two before informed opinions can be made, and we do need to allow SCV to clean and edit the show. I thought the opening sequence was brilliant visually [sCV this year]. I wish SCV well this year, but that style of show is very difficult to pull off. Let's see what happens.

Hello drum corps fans: I am in need of 8 tickets for DCI Finals. I already have semi-finals tickets for my family and friends, but now need 8 for Finals. I will pay face value + shipping, and will buy via a secure and safe method (Paypal, COD, etc.). Email: jwillis35@me.com if interested in selling to work out further details. JW

In all honesty, I think we need to stop speculating why that run through was closed. Slinging mud is not getting us closer to the truth, and Crown does have a right to run a closed rehearsal. As spectators we PAY to attend the show (which did happen). Corps are more careful today because of social media sharing and the types of amazing electronic recorders that can capture content that is copyrighted and very costly. Also, if Crown was rehearsing at the show site, and their run through was about 1 hour or so prior to the start of the show, then I bet it was the stadium people that asked the crowd to leave. They need time to setup their personnel, concessions, be sure no one is in the stadium without a ticket to the show, and they need to double check all areas for security reasons. Drum corps is having a hard time selling its product because, to some degree, we have a lot of folks that wish to watch rehearsals, watch warm-ups in the lot, and not always buy a ticket and just attend the show. Many of these folks will then by a cheap General Admission seat and come in for their one, maybe two corps (sometimes even standing with staff or finding open seats in the reserved areas). I'm not saying that I am against this, but clearly the corps receive no money for these services, and often they find their product on video sites, being passed around for others to check out. This is no different than what was going on years ago with Napster. It might be fun, but it doesn't help the corps, and it is illegal. People can say that they would never do this (and I am sure most would not), but the protections that all the corps must put into place today are necessary. If I were the OP, certainly I would have been upset to some extent, more of a "darn, I really wanted to watch that." But in the long run, they did get what they paid for, and they took a gamble on that rehearsal and were allowed to watch for some time. Bonus! But when the free candy stops being thrown, it's time to go back to the world of supporting drum corps and not expecting a handout!

From another post: "Could you tell me a corps that has a policy that no one can watch them rehearse?" True. INT. rehearsals are closed at all times. Interestingly enough, when they perform, it seems a lot of fans leave the stands for refreshments and a smoke! Maybe we just don't know enough about them.

At this point, who the heck knows. Bluecoats and Phantom Regiment looked amazing to me at BGSU. Crown and Cadets look amazing from what I can tell on FN. We know Blue Devils are good, just a teeny weeny bit good! :-) And SCV had one of the more magical shows last year. I'd say the above corps are likely your top 6. Cavaliers, although always good, have some issues with their 1st and 4th productions. I like 2 & 3, but feel the overall design will hurt them. Music GE is only really good in no. 2, the ballad is OK, and 1 & 4 need massive work IMO. I see them or Blue Stars in 7th. The battle for 9, 10, 11, and 12 is going to be fierce, much like the last few years. Madison is on the prowl with a great show. Maybe the best opening statement on the field this summer, and I think the vehicle is there for them to do quite, maybe 9th. Glassmen have a rough draft of a program that actually has some nice impact moment, but the performance levels must improve; and Spirit is off to a great start. Blue Knights have a master writing drill. I saw the Crossmen, and they were not too far off Glassmen, and I believe they have a corps that can challenge for top 12 this year. Also remember that the Colts just tore the joint down last year in semifinals and just missed out on top 12 (I thought they were in, with all respect to Troopers). My year-end prediction is: 1. Phantom Regiment (just trust me on this, they have the show) 2. Cadets (this show has all the goods, and when their performance levels improve they will pass Crown) 3. Carolina Crown 4. Bluecoats (maybe their best show ever, but certainly up there with the best) 5. Blue Devils 6. Santa Clara Vanguard 7. Blue Stars 8. Cavaliers 9. Blue Knights 10. Madison Scouts 11. Spirit of Atlanta (I just like this name better) 12. Crossmen I do reserve the right to change my mind. It tends to wander a lot anyway, so that usually happens without me thinking about it. :-)

Hey NR_Ohiobando, very nice job to you and the BGSU leadership band for the national anthem. That was very well played, and I love the trumpet descant on the last strain. Too bad you had to leave the show.

You sound jealous and uninformed. Poor thing.

Man, that poor cashier. That is a classic, and very typical drum corps story. I love to hear that kind of stuff. I would have loved to have seen her face. Who knows, maybe she was bored and her day was brightened. The folks at Starbucks near the BGSU stadium were prepping to close their store when they got slammed by myself and others after the show. They were shocked.