jjeffeory Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 Good Question!What is Drum Corps? Define it. Is it what people who marched in the 70's, say it is? how bout even before DCI was formed? Or is what people who marched in the 2000's say it is? Not your opinion, but really what is it? It's different than high school marching band, not the same... Level of excellence is not a factor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JT76 Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 It's different than high school marching band, not the same... Level of excellence is not a factor. Everyone's opinion of High School marching band is different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madscout96 Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 Having a bass player beef up your tuba parts, for any corps, is a cop out. Having a bass player do a bass solo feature or something, not a cop out. Why? Because contras don't have a volume knob. I think they're BOTH cop outs. If a bass player does a bass solo or feature, he's taking something away from somebody else. A tuba player could have done that. Or the tuba section. Or the timpani player, or even marimba player. Would it be the same if it would be on electric bass? Of course not. But the point is to hear it done by brass and percussion. The point is to hear the Flower Duet from Phantom Regiment 2007 done with a trumpet and mello (right?), not 2 female singers. The point is to hear the Madison Scouts in 1987 play the piccolo part of the trio in Stars and Stripes Forever on a piccolo sop bugle, not an actual piccolo. The point is to hear jazz piano comping and melodic lines played not by a piano, but by marimbas and vibes. The point is to hear Santa Clara Vanguard in 1991 make the sounds of helicopters somehow with drums, not by pushing a button on a synth. I could go on and on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrunchyTenor Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 Ask yourself?1. Was pitting the front ensemble a cop out? No. While I don't think you should be able to play anything in drum corps that requires a power source, anyone who carried the marching keys can tell you how happy they were to put them down. 2. Was going to 3 valves a cop out? No. It just added full chromatics to an existing instrument. It was still acoustic and still in G. But we'll save the any-key debate for another time. 3. Was the vocal stuff that Cadets and Bluecoats did a cop out? Not until they added mikes and an amplifier. 4. Was going from 128 members and increasing the corps sizes a cop out? Only if it leads to other corps not getting enough members to compete. 5 (fix'd). Is having a bass player for effect a cop out? For effect? I'd really have to hear it. I'm not a fan of amplification and electronics. What I'm reading, though, is that the bass isn't being used so much for effect as it is a primary voice or a substitute for contras. The primary voices in drum corps are brass and percussion. If you feel the need to augment it with effects, well I guess there are enough instructors and directors who agree and changed the rules. But to substitute an electronic instrument for a primary voice is going over the line. Brass instructors have had people change instruments before to balance the line. Sops going to mello, or vice versa. Same with baritones, euphs and contras. Why Spirit feels the need to use an electric bass instead of adjusting the line is something only they can answer. But as a fan of Spirit since 1978, especially some of the best balanced and loudest brasslines EVER with equal talent in percussion, I really hate to see them go down this road. I think the activity has been trying to find itself, or innovate, just as many corps are. I will say that I believe Spirit has been reborn with this show. I am glad that they is taking a chance and doing something that stirs the pot, if you will. I'll have to disagree. If the activity is "trying to find itself", I have some very simple directions. It's called brass, percussion and auxiliary/guard. Morphing into something else isn't finding yourself. It's being completely lost. Thanks for reading... And to you, too! Garry in Vegas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDale Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 OK you're losing me here. I can understand how there can be balance problems, but don't the brass and battery have the job of making the music?It's been a while since I've been to a show, but I seem to remember this vaguely... You should have seen them last night in Rockford. They have redefined the focus of the music and I must admit, not really in a rock style, but in a jazz band style, on the field. The calypso element was very profound as well. When the horns march, that will further cut down on their sound, especially with the highly amped pit. Let's see what the judges have to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruckner8 Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 It's different than high school marching band, not the same... Level of excellence is not a factor. Wow...for my money the level of excellence IS the defining factor! The winter program (practice) The month of spring training (practice) The tour (practice) The shows (result) Note that I didn't specify the genre. It's just a coincidence that the genre has been called drum corps, and the genre has been re-inventing itself via instrumnetation. So what? Bring on the woodwinds, I say! I'm entertained by excellence. I'm cool with Amps...unless it sucks. I'm cool with Synths....unless it sucks. I'm cool with Woodwinds...unless it sucks. I'm sure this year will be a crappy year for synths, just like 2004 was awful for amped voice....there are a lot very creative--but not very realistic--people working for drum corps. Trial and error is all they know, no matter how many times those of us with logical brains warn them! Oh, and the outdoor element. That's incredibly important to me. I have absolutely no interest in WGI. If I'm indoors, I'm paying for the Chicago Symphony or Broadway show. I couldn't care less about WGI and its indoor implementation. And even when I'm forced to watch WGI on youtube, it's never as excellent as championship drum corps. The acoustic element will never go away. I do predict hornlines getting smaller, however, and the synth's role getting larger. I'm a brass jock, so that bums me out alittle. But as long as there are drums and bugles, and as long as the excellence is there (not a given...creative artists push the envelope to such levels that excellence is not even achievable), I'll be going. And booing those corps with "Yay kids! Boo staff!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j.morgus Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 Good Question!What is Drum Corps? Define it. Is it what people who marched in the 70's, say it is? how bout even before DCI was formed? Or is what people who marched in the 2000's say it is? Not your opinion, but really what is it? JT, In your oppinion, is Spirit good this year because of the show? Or is the show good because it is Spirit? Just wondering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SF2K4 Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 No one tries to add a brass instrument (other than a F horn) to a woodwind quintet... No one tries to add musical accompaniment to an A Capella group... No one hooks up to an amp if they're putting on an acoustic concert... So why is the idea that drum corps has it's own musical instrumentation and style (just like all other forms do) of performing music using brass and percussion not able to hold water like the rest? If a number of groups played the same tune, say an orchestra, a rock band, a choir, a symphony (the ensemble the original piece was written for), a high school marching band, and a drum corps, wouldn't we want each group to have it's own unique sound? Let me go further, none of those groups should sound like one is better than the other (IE: Drum corps shouldn't just should just sound like a better marching band) nor should we think any sound like a "lite" verison (IE: Drum corps shouldn't sound like symphony-lite)... in my mind each group uses it's instrumentation and style to sound DIFFERENT... and in every other musical realm it's that uniqueness that makes the ensemble special... yet in drum corps we apparently want the ensembles to sound as much like something already out there as possible... my question is why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cainan Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 No. While I don't think you should be able to play anything in drum corps that requires a power source, anyone who carried the marching keys can tell you how happy they were to put them down.No. It just added full chromatics to an existing instrument. It was still acoustic and still in G. But we'll save the any-key debate for another time. Not until they added mikes and an amplifier. Only if it leads to other corps not getting enough members to compete. For effect? I'd really have to hear it. I'm not a fan of amplification and electronics. What I'm reading, though, is that the bass isn't being used so much for effect as it is a primary voice or a substitute for contras. The primary voices in drum corps are brass and percussion. If you feel the need to augment it with effects, well I guess there are enough instructors and directors who agree and changed the rules. But to substitute an electronic instrument for a primary voice is going over the line. Brass instructors have had people change instruments before to balance the line. Sops going to mello, or vice versa. Same with baritones, euphs and contras. Why Spirit feels the need to use an electric bass instead of adjusting the line is something only they can answer. But as a fan of Spirit since 1978, especially some of the best balanced and loudest brasslines EVER with equal talent in percussion, I really hate to see them go down this road. I'll have to disagree. If the activity is "trying to find itself", I have some very simple directions. It's called brass, percussion and auxiliary/guard. Morphing into something else isn't finding yourself. It's being completely lost. And to you, too! Garry in Vegas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bawker Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 Not your opinion, but really what is it? . . and, of course, the Up with People answer is "whatever it becomes", since, drum corps has become some nebulous, artistic pursuit that defies description. Somehow, drum corps and marching band is an artistic endeavor that we can never truly grasp. Are we really going to make the argument that marching band is beyond definition? That people who march around in quasi-military uniforms to other peoples work that has been arranged for them is something truly beyond our ability to define? That bass guitars, bugles, fifes, woodwinds and blah blah blah actively moves towards the ultimate expression of a separate, unique art form? Really? People outside of music education, music performance and music in general have a pretty good idea of what a marching band is. Apparently, none of us on the inside looking out do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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