TOP 10 things IN 2009 we think but dare not say!

[DrinkinOuttaCups]

I think that there's a reason why threads like this survive. If you attend a MLB game there not many people in the crowd who actually played professional baseball. Ditto the NFL. But if you attend a Drum Corps show then there's probably a lot of people in the crowd who have actually done it before, so they tend to be far more opinionated. That's only a theory on my own behalf, but it just seems that way.

The exception to that is the Normal, IL show. Consists mostly of drum corps fanatics (bandos), and is still one of my favorite shows ever.

[ShortAndFast]

It is not that we are whining

Really?

But, instead, the infamy of the #13 will live on...i.e. everyone will always remember that BD's 13th victory was for a show that DID NOT DESERVE the championship win, it was simply a "we're sorry" gift from the judges!!!

You know, I've enjoyed Crown's shows for almost this entire decade, but posts like this make me feel like the organization must be doing something terribly wrong to produce supporters with such attitudes. Did you notice at retreat how BD's horn line applauded when Crown won high brass? You might consider displaying a similar amount of graciousness towards a corps that had a lot of excellence this summer, regardless of whether you enjoyed their show or not.

[contrajedi8]

It is not that we are whining, we are just stating the facts as supported by many other posters on the forums. BD had a TERRIBLY BORING show that hardly anyone understood, whereas CROWN was the FAVORITE!!!!!! Did you miss the part where we were awarded the FAN FAVORITE award from the FAN NETWORK?!?!?! Given the kind of preference that is ALWAYS shown to BD by the judges, it is a little hard for us not to feel that BD was simply "handed" this championship to make up for BD's whining last year. If it weren't for that bias, everyone knows Crown would have been the champion this year!!

But, instead, the infamy of the #13 will live on...i.e. everyone will always remember that BD's 13th victory was for a show that DID NOT DESERVE the championship win, it was simply a "we're sorry" gift from the judges!!! Personally, the fact that Crown's 2009 show will be talked about for years to come as being completely innovative, the crowd favorite to win, plus the fact that it was such a beautiful blend of the best of WGI elements (i.e. body movement, creative guard uniforms and color enchancement of green plumes and drum covers), with our incomparable brass sound will only intensify the feeling that we got robbed the championship is a much better legacy than the way people are going to laugh about BD's 2009 gimme 13th victory for a show where they SAT instead of MARCHED, so I'll take that.

Thank you for proving my point.

[barigirl78]

The exception to that is the Normal, IL show. Consists mostly of drum corps fanatics (bandos), and is still one of my favorite shows ever.

Fans of baseball and football are every bit as opinionated. If you don't believe me, go to any NY bar right now and bring up the Mets.

Or go to a Philly bar and bring up the pros and cons of Donovan McNabb as Eagles QB.

[bawker]

BD had a TERRIBLY BORING show that hardly anyone understood, whereas CROWN was the FAVORITE!!!!!!

It was about 1930 . . .that was the show title. Anyone who has even a passing interest in US history can tell you that this was during the Great Depression. The music reflected that, for starters.

Did you miss the part where we were awarded the FAN FAVORITE award from the FAN NETWORK?!?!?!

Fan favorite and best executed don't always go together. See: Madison Scouts 1995.

Given the kind of preference that is ALWAYS shown to BD by the judges, it is a little hard for us not to feel that BD was simply "handed" this championship to make up for BD's whining last year. If it weren't for that bias, everyone knows Crown would have been the champion this year!!

No, Crown was held back for the same reason 10 other corps were on Finals night: they didn't clean what they had quite well enough to make up the gap.

But, instead, the infamy of the #13 will live on...i.e. everyone will always remember that BD's 13th victory was for a show that DID NOT DESERVE the championship win, it was simply a "we're sorry" gift from the judges!!!

Really? BD had a killer show in 1988 that lost on Finals week, with a lot of the same music rep. Maybe it was payback for 1988 instead.

Either way, that idea is ludicrious.

Personally, the fact that Crown's 2009 show will be talked about for years to come as being completely innovative, the crowd favorite to win, plus the fact that it was such a beautiful blend of the best of WGI elements (i.e. body movement, creative guard uniforms and color enchancement of green plumes and drum covers), with our incomparable brass sound will only intensify the feeling that we got robbed the championship is a much better legacy than the way people are going to laugh about BD's 2009 gimme 13th victory for a show where they SAT instead of MARCHED, so I'll take that.

If anything, BD knows how to use WGI elements as well as anyone (see: James Logan ). . .. and winning one Jim Ott doesn't make a brass sound "incomparable".

Crown is amazing; the organization has amazing people in it . . .and the kids came really close this year to winning it all.

However, to slight the fact that the Blue Devils won as a "gimme" really doesn't do anything but make it seem like there's sour grapes. . .I'm pretty sure the members and administration are pleased with this years result, and, if you asked them, they'd probably speak highly of the Blue Devils as well.

That said, perhaps we could take a cue from them.

[BCS513]

Here are thoughts that I have had that i'm sure are improbable and possibly impossible, but wouldn't mind if they occurred.

1) Getting rid of World and Open class and only having one class with about 20-25 total corps. Quality vs Quantity.

2) Decreasing the length of shows by 1 minute.

3) DCI becoming more competitive somehow. How exactly, I'm not sure. Like, I want corps to hate each other, I want them to want to beat the crap out of their competition. And that anger/competitive streak that they have building inside of them can be used during their shows to help them perform the hell out of their shows. (maybe this happens already i'm not sure). I would love for every single member of every corps to take a defeat PERSONAL. But because this is such a subjective activity, it is harder to get that mean streak going as opposed to a sport to where you are in direct competition with someone else and there are no judges.

4) Just like major league sports, its competition but its also entertainment. In DCI, the majority of the fans go to shows to be entertained, not to actually see who is better than the other, at least IMO. Well, since this is already such a subjective activity, I wouldn't mind seeing fans opinions actually count. Fans who go to shows would vote using some kind of device, and they could only vote once. Obviously they will vote for whoever they want to vote for but it will be suggested for them to vote for who they thought was the "best" corps of the night. And the weight of the vote on the overall placements would be like 30% or 40%, and the other 60% or 70% would be the judging.

5) Increasing the age limit to 25.

[PhantomCadet1934]

I'm fairly new to the drum corps world, but this is my opinion:

1. Why doesn't anyone realize that if they stop griping about the bad things, and stop and think about it, things aren't really that bad. Attendence at the two shows I was at was standing-room only (and I got there an hour early), and though I didn't go to finals, I heard it was still packed.

2. Any year, you're not going to like every show. Some years are worse than others, but that doesn't mean drum corps is dying.

3. Electronics was a new thing this year; they're going to experiment with it. As with anything new, not every show is going to turn out well. Give it a few years, then complain.

4. It seems like everybody here is some sort of alumni complaining that drum corps has changed since the 70s or 80s or whenever. Well...it's been 30 years, what do you expect?

Stop trying to make drum corps what it used to be, and focus on getting the most out of what it IS.

Hi, welcome to the activity. I am fairly new myself, as I started to follow in 2005.

1. Things are that bad, IMO. While attendance at smaller, local shows may be fantastic... Due to poor venue choice, I believe that attendance at major regionals and Championships will begin and continue to deteriorate, especially if DCI keeps the same seating chart for finals!!! $125 for seats on the 20 or the 10?! That's insanity!!!

2. I don't think the point is that the activity is dying because you don't like who won.

3. Electronics are a major complaining point. While I'm sure the kinks will be ironed out in the coming years, I still believe this takes some of the merit out of the hornlines, allowing the electronics to cover up musical gaps that could also be filled in by the pit or hornline. Is this a rip on the kids (my peers?) NO. It is a rip on show design.

4. I am not an alum of any corps. I am a 20 year old student hoping to march what would be my rook-out season next year. Change happens, but to me, it seems like a little too much, too soon. To me, Drum Corps has been a distinct activity from high school bands, although as these rule changes come and go, they seem to be getting closer and closer.

There is still plenty to get out of the activity based on what it was. Horns, drums, pit, and guard. Without electricity. It just involves a little more creativity from the show designers. While some change I believe is good, not all change is good, and at times, parts of the status quo should be maintained.

[Steven69]

BD's horn line applauded when Crown won high brass?

LOL, BD's horn line only politely applauded Crown when they won high brass and rather than looking like they truly were happy for them, it appeared to more closely reflect a badly disguised effort to try and correct the bad taste in everyone's mouth BD after the appalling display of bad sportsmanship they displayed at last year's retreat. However, their polite golf clap didn't do a lot to correct that impression imho.

[Jeff Ream]

I think that there's a reason why threads like this survive. If you attend a MLB game there not many people in the crowd who actually played professional baseball. Ditto the NFL. But if you attend a Drum Corps show then there's probably a lot of people in the crowd who have actually done it before, so they tend to be far more opinionated. That's only a theory on my own behalf, but it just seems that way.

never been to a game in Philly have you?

[highpitch_83]

What I dare not say (until now):

- Until the perc cam & perc judge audio track returns I will not buy another DCI DVD.

- PR 2007 was musically superior show to PR 2008. (I am irrational on this subject...)

- At Stillwater this year my top 3 groups (in order of enjoyment were): 1. MN Brass (DCA), 2. Blue Stars 3 (tie). Phantom/Cavaliers

- I would rather watch a drumline stand still and attempt a difficult passage that takes all season to clean (or doesn't quite make it) than another double-stroke roll+paradiddlediddle+pudada /repeat\ passage with body movement layered on top. (Murray Gussek/SCV 2004 did it better than you ever will and they did it on the move - bring something fresh to the table)

- There is no reason for any balance issues between an amped pit and the rest of the corps when you have a "sound guy" on staff - ESPECIALLY DURING FINALS WEEK WHEN YOU HAVE UP TO 3 OPPORTUNITIES TO PERFORM IN THE SAME VENUE!

- Props suck: they clutter up the field unnecessarily and IMO every corps that has used them over the last few years could have produced a show that was equally if not more effective utilizing their members instead of props. see: Blue Stars '08/'09, Cadets '06-'08 ('05 wouldn't have worked without the mirror/box), Blue Devils '09.

- (already noted on this thread) the "00:30 of fun repeated" method of arranging has been exhausted completely IMO. I'm not looking for youtube-ready segments, I'm a captive audience (in the stands, theater or on FN) and want to be taken on a journey!

** Exemption: Crown 2008: "Finis" - for their masterful integration of all those amazing charts

- The "body movement" era officially jumped the shark once guard members (from multiple corps) began climbing on the hornline/drumline (and vice versa). Show me you know how to write a decent visual transition instead of relying on body movement/gimmicks to fill in the gaps.