charlie1223 Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 (edited) People are free to stand in the lot and not go see the early corps perform, that is true. And it may be because these people are only interested in seeing BD, SCV, Cadets, etc... not denying that. Nevertheless, the staff and members of these so-called 'top' corps have different ways they can approach the issue: They can choose to ignore the issue, choose to discourage the issue, or choose to encourage the issue. In years past most staff and members either ignored the issue or discouraged it by asking people to go see all of the show perfromances in the stadium. However, in recent years most of those involved with the so-called top corps have chosen to highly encourage people to 'come see us in the lot because we are the show'. That ego mindedness would not really be a problem with me, and I do understand it is a recruiting tool for the top-corps, (except) that the Directors of these same corps are also members of the DCI voting body; and as such they are supposed to also promote the entire activity within DCI and not just promote the narcissistic notion that their particular corps is the only corps people need to support. I'm curious as to which corps have explicitly encouraged that people see them in the lot or if there is any evidence that they even promoted themselves in the lot in the first place? I really think its a matter of people's choice and not that the corps promote their lots. Also, what would you have a top corps do? Encourage people to view other corps lots and give a time and destination of when those lots occur? What to you would constitute a top corps promoting all of DCI and not just themselves as you claim they are? I don't really see any real life evidence of what you are claiming. Cadets, for example, are hosting a show in Chambersburg that they are promoting as "#TheFanShow" and it seems pretty clear from the advertisement that they are promoting all corps at the event and not just their own And there are even pictures of each of the corps performing in the article. Does this satisfy you? Plus, I'm interested what "live commentary from their programming staff" means... Edited February 20, 2014 by charlie1223 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flammaster Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 I show up so early for shows I get to watch both lot and show. Is there any other way? it's an all day thing for me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 (edited) People are free to stand in the lot and not go see the early corps perform, that is true. And it may be because these people are only interested in seeing BD, SCV, Cadets, etc... not denying that. Nevertheless, the staff and members of these so-called 'top' corps have different ways they can approach the issue: They can choose to ignore the issue, choose to discourage the issue, or choose to encourage the issue. In years past most staff and members either ignored the issue or discouraged it by asking people to go see all of the show perfromances in the stadium. However, in recent years most of those involved with the so-called top corps have chosen to highly encourage people to 'come see us in the lot because we are the show'. That ego mindedness would not really be a problem with me, and I do understand it is a recruiting tool for the top-corps, (except) that the Directors of these same corps are also members of the DCI voting body; and as such they are supposed to also promote the entire activity within DCI and not just promote the narcissistic notion that their particular corps is the only corps people need to support. well thats interesting..Ive have never heard anyone say come see us in the lot....maybe a few on FB do...I try not to indulge AS a matter of fact The diverse group of staff's I have worked with don't want the distraction on many levels of spectators...I know most of the time. People are attracted to the best of the best in the activity, there's no doubt of that and I suppose one can debate if thats right or not BUT what activity out there isnt the same , the best of the best attracting the spectators... Edited February 20, 2014 by GUARDLING 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truman Posted February 20, 2014 Author Share Posted February 20, 2014 I am a self admitted lot rat. Sometimes I feel guilty about that. I do understand that every corps would love to have me in the stands for their performance, and luckily I usually see enough shows that I get to see most everybody at least once before I "skip" them to stay in the lot at another show. I also can't think of too many shows I have been to that haven't also included me watching someone practice all day before the show either. Getting the chance to see things "behind the scenes" so to speak is something I really enjoy about the activity, and I think it makes me appreciate things that are on the field even more. If you were at the Olympics right now and had the choice of watching the 15-19th place runs of the figure skaters, or hanging within a few feet of watching the gold or silver medalists prepare, maybe even having a chance to meet them and talk with them, wouldn't that be an awesome choice to have? If I buy the ticket to the show, I think that qualifies as my support to everyone on at least some level. I also know some "early" appearing corps love to have some people think enough of them to watch them in the lot as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 QUOTED BY BRASSO: I see two sides here. Art indeed does not necessarily exist for observers. A friend of mine once said, and I agree, that the purpose of art is expression but not necessarily communication. There are people who write poems, paint, sing, etc. for themselves with no expectation that any audience will ever know their work. ... NOT QUOTED BY BRASSO: On the other hand, Orson Welles is reported to have said, "Anyone who talks about making movies and doesn't mention money is a jackass". Art that costs more money than the artist can afford does indeed require financial support, whether from wealthy benefactors (I work in a theatre and about half our income comes from donations), or convincing enough our your fellow citizens to support public arts funding (which is tiny in the United States as compared to other industrialized nations: in 2013, the Netherlands cut their national arts funding by 25%, or $265,000,000; that reduction alone is more than 50% larger than the entire budget of the U.S. National Endowment for the Arts, which is $158,000,000--and the U.S. is 18 times larger than the Netherlands; I wonder: are any Dutch drum corps subsidized by the government?), or, yes, by keeping a large group of drum corps fans entertained. And that's noble. Do art and music for "self-expression" (as you said); maybe even do such self-expression all by oneself to the point that not a soul knows about it, as you stated here. But don't you think this theory goes out the window in practice when you print up tickets to that "self-expression" and charge big bucks to others to watch you "self-express" yourself?. In other words, doesn't the performer have an obligation to provide the ticket purchaser with some level of communication with that customer that subsidizes the performer's very existence to "self-express" themselves long-term? Anybody can write poems, paint, sing a song, etc. all by themselves, or just for their family and friends' amusement. As a matter of fact, that's how most of this is done, and throughout history, too. But the dynamic completely changes, imo, once you begin to charge admission to it all. I'm pretty sure that the parts of my original post I've bolded in this quote at least began to address your subsequent question. However, I think it's more complicated than either of us indicated. First, because there is usually some audience for art that many people don't like, and we don't know how many supporters in the DCI audience, for instance, the Blue Devils really need to be successful; perhaps not many, given the alternate revenue streams they've been able to find. Second, because advertising and media often make it possible for audiences to know what they're in for before buying their tickets. If you don't like what the Blue Devils are doing, don't go to competitions where they appear. Third, and perhaps most important, if all an artist should do is give the audience what they want, then the audience should just make the art themselves. A great artist has the ability to give the audience what they didn't know they wanted until they saw it. On such grounds, the Blue Devils in particular are to be commended for pushing in new directions. On the other hand (there's that phrase again), to experiment is to risk failure. It ought to be allowed that not every new direction is a successful direction, but to take the example of the Blue Devils again, well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott St Sinclaire Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 (edited) If fans thought your attitude toward them was the dominant one among the DCI powers-that-be, DCI would soon cease to exist. Anyway, the "asinine proposal" was taken seriously enough by the corps directors that, following some revision, it will be reconsidered in March. The proposal isnt going to pass (hint hint, Im rather close to that circle and its not being taken seriously (as it shouldnt), as there are so many obvious flaws with it... it would be just a "show" proposal and have no real merit nor value). and the fan base is quite well aware that they are NOT talented, creative designers... they are there to be wowed and impressed... in some circumstances to be inspired and learn... the audience are not peers,but rather spectators... do you understand what it takes to be a dci calibre judge? Its not simply filling out a questionnaire and putting on a tacky green golf shirt. Edited February 20, 2014 by Scott St Sinclaire Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cixelsyd Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 I am a self admitted lot rat. Sometimes I feel guilty about that. I do understand that every corps would love to have me in the stands for their performance, and luckily I usually see enough shows that I get to see most everybody at least once before I "skip" them to stay in the lot at another show. I also can't think of too many shows I have been to that haven't also included me watching someone practice all day before the show either. Getting the chance to see things "behind the scenes" so to speak is something I really enjoy about the activity, and I think it makes me appreciate things that are on the field even more. If you were at the Olympics right now and had the choice of watching the 15-19th place runs of the figure skaters, or hanging within a few feet of watching the gold or silver medalists prepare, maybe even having a chance to meet them and talk with them, wouldn't that be an awesome choice to have? If I buy the ticket to the show, I think that qualifies as my support to everyone on at least some level. Obviously, some choose to (mis)interpret your behavior as proof that only the corps you sit in your seat for are "selling tickets". I am glad you took the time to explain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cixelsyd Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 and the fan base is quite well aware that they are NOT talented, creative designers... That is not quite literally true. Actually, seeing that there are so many marching bands, winter guards, drumlines, etc., there are thousands of designers out there. With only 40 drum corps participating in DCI, that leaves most of those thousands of designers on the sidelines during DCI season. I would expect that quite a number of them are among the audiences at DCI shows. do you understand what it takes to be a dci calibre judge? Its not simply filling out a questionnaire and putting on a tacky green golf shirt. Oh, I know. You also need khaki pants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cixelsyd Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 (edited) Huh? I think -- by definition -- a performing art has an audience. Perhaps you meant to just say "art" in which case I'd agree. Sorry. What I meant was that a youth program in the performing arts need not, by definition, rely on a paying audience for its financial survival. I think your generalization "school band programs are tax-subsidized" is not universally true any more. Many scholastic music programs would cease to exist without their booster organization paying the bills. That is why I said "Where school band programs are tax-subsidized...". Edited February 20, 2014 by cixelsyd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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