MikeRapp Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 There have been a few of this phenomena over the last several years that still amaze me...I'm probably forgetting some others I'm sure... Boston Crusaders 1998 15th Boston Crusaders 1999 9th Carolina Crown 2002 16th Carolina Crown 2003 10th Troopers 2008 16th Troopers 2009 12th The Academy 2015 15th The Academy 2016 11th This is interesting...but what about within the same season? How many, if any, corps jumped five spots during the season? And how many did that within the top 10? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liahona Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 I would also guess that the sheer number of people on staff at any of the World Class corps dwarfs the staffs of 20 years ago. I absolutely agree with this...does make a big difference too IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cixelsyd Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 I use 10th only as a number say 12th pick anyone you want. Corps today for sure are more consistent than ever before. Higher levels from top to bottom. There's no denying that. Agree on the "higher levels", but not on "consistent". Overall, world class corps were no less consistent in 1987. If anything, we have more obvious inconsistencies from show to show stemming from increased use of electronics and props - issues that do not require a trained eye/ear to discern. If you need to go back 20 years to prove a point on anything, as many love to do( not saying you at all ) and sometimes even further than that the point is moot imo. 20 years plus ago is just that , a lifetime ago.. You have it backwards (or down side up, by modern jargon). You are proving my point. Regardless of corps consistency or relative improvement, you will not likely see 1st and 10th cross paths competitively in a modern season, or any other similar crossing. The best thing a corps can do to move the competitive bar is to come out strong, as the initial scores in a season are the most pliable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liahona Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 (edited) This is interesting...but what about within the same season? How many, if any, corps jumped five spots during the season? And how many did that within the top 10? I don't know how many....BUT Boston JUMPED from 12th to 5th within the 2000 season...that is obviously MORE than 5 spots...Anything is possible! Late June/Early July the Boston Crusaders were seeded 12th based on below results...and by finals they rose to 5th... Beverly, MA 7/2 Boston Crusaders 70.6 7/2 The Cadets 80.4 7/2 carolina crown 71.65 7/2 Crossmen 71.55 San Jose, CA 7/1 SCV 78.3 7/1 Glassmen 77.95 7/1 Blue knights 75.85 Michigan City, IN 7/1 cavaliers 80.20 7/1 Madison Scouts 73.40 7/1 Phantom Regiment 73.35 Costa Mesa, CA 6/25 Blue Devils 82.8 Streator, IL 6/30 Bluecoats 71.2 Finals Results 1 Cadets 97.65 1 Cavaliers 97.65 3 Blue Devils 96.90 4 Vanguard 94.70 5 Boston 92.35 6 Blue Knights 92.00 7 Phantom 90.65 8 Glassmen 90.35 9 Crossmen 88.55 10 Madison Scouts 85.50 11 Carolina Crown 85.15 12 Bluecoats 84.40 Edited October 4, 2016 by Liahona 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liahona Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 Agree on the "higher levels", but not on "consistent". Overall, world class corps were no less consistent in 1987. If anything, we have more obvious inconsistencies from show to show stemming from increased use of electronics and props - issues that do not require a trained eye/ear to discern. I wonder though on these glaring issues...how much is actually being "discounted" so to speak?...We've seen MANY missteps in these areas (especially electronics) yet there hasn't been a "change" in scoring to reflect the missteps made by the corps IMO...the corps seems to get a pass... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 (edited) Agree on the "higher levels", but not on "consistent". Overall, world class corps were no less consistent in 1987. If anything, we have more obvious inconsistencies from show to show stemming from increased use of electronics and props - issues that do not require a trained eye/ear to discern. You have it backwards (or down side up, by modern jargon). You are proving my point. Regardless of corps consistency or relative improvement, you will not likely see 1st and 10th cross paths competitively in a modern season, or any other similar crossing. The best thing a corps can do to move the competitive bar is to come out strong, as the initial scores in a season are the most pliable. The point is, and I think I said it many times . It is not just about what I my do with my corps but what others are also doing. When we look at a corps improvement , especially if it is the one we want to improve we don't consider what others are doing the same thing, maybe at a faster rate, or slower rate BUT it effects it all. I will agree coming out strong BUT more so being able to develop on a program is extremely important, maybe the most important thing.. I do have to respectfully disagree about the electronics and props, etc etc. Its very easy to judge if something works or doesnt even if at a very basic level. Edited October 4, 2016 by GUARDLING Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 I would also guess that the sheer number of people on staff at any of the World Class corps dwarfs the staffs of 20 years ago. OMG thats for sure. This can be a topic all its own. People wonder sometimes how some of the icons in the activity have been around so long and still at a very high level. Well, I think it has something for sure to do with this. BITD we had to do it all, WE didn't have specialists is a certain thing as much as now. Corps did not shell out the money for 10 staff or more for a section. You were hired to do all of it with maybe an assistant .WE had to cross over bitd and learn as much as we could on EVERYTHING..lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liahona Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 I do have to respectfully disagree about the electronics and props, etc etc. Its very easy to judge if something works or doesnt even if at a very basic level. I argue that while it may be EASY to judge...there hasn't been any real penalties in the scores for electronic missteps...why not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liahona Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 The point is, and I think I said it many times . It is not just about what I my do with my corps but what others are also doing. The first can be controlled...the second cannot...which leads to a lot of disappointment from a particular corps fans... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 I argue that while it may be EASY to judge...there hasn't been any real penalties in the scores for electronic missteps...why not? Such as? missteps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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