Liahona Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 (edited) this yes but a winning staff is just 1 part of the puzzle. Many more factors and what others are doing and of course a little luck doesnt hurt..lol I will ask...what are the other parts of the puzzle in your opinion of course? Edited October 3, 2016 by Liahona Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 (edited) I will ask...what are the other parts of the puzzle in your opinion of course? Big part is Admin. of a corps. You can have all the talent in the world and if the Admin. don't get it, I mean really get it. Good luck with that. Without naming names look back at some very good staff that have gone through the ranks of some lower corps and never had movement some never close to a finals or semi for that matter. Members of course play a part, compatibility of staff, money, everyone on the same page rather than everyone wanting to be the cover story so to speak, vision, a very well planned out tour with ample time to complete the vision, ability to listen and put ego aside ( a hard one..lol ).ability to see the big picture,..there's just a few things imo Edited October 3, 2016 by GUARDLING 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cixelsyd Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 I think when we come up with these what if's we tailor it to fit the argument.Do we really believe that corps X coming out in 10th going to jump to top 3? Putting aside the obvious IMO we are talking only a minimal amount of time to actually do this. Time is never on our side when catch up is the game played. Given the level of competition today do you reallyy believe a 10th place corps coming out of the gate could go to 1st? lets look at this realistically. If a corps is so good as to jump that much in 8 weeks then why did they come out in 10th. Obviously there's a reason why a corps would come out 10th which would prevent such a jump. Since you keep mentioning 10th, here is some context. Back in 1987, the Garfield Cadets lost to Spirit of Atlanta three times in June/July, yet it was Garfield that won DCI and Spirit that finished 10th. This was simply a case of one corps improving much more than another during the season, and judges calling it as it happened. Now, if corps are so much better today, the margins between them should be narrower. Why would we expect less movement between corps? Should be more. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeRapp Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 Since you keep mentioning 10th, here is some context. Back in 1987, the Garfield Cadets lost to Spirit of Atlanta three times in June/July, yet it was Garfield that won DCI and Spirit that finished 10th. This was simply a case of one corps improving much more than another during the season, and judges calling it as it happened. Now, if corps are so much better today, the margins between them should be narrower. Why would we expect less movement between corps? Should be more. I would argue that 1987 was a completely different landscape than DCI today. The shows are infinitely more demanding, far more moving pieces, and to be honest the level of competitiveness in the 6-15 range is incomparable. Today, it is remarkable to accomplish what Academy did—which was to make finals after competing in the low teens for the early part of the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 Will this now be a permanent gig for BAC? http://www.bostonglobe.com/business/2016/10/03/boston-pops-deal-with-mugar-will-keep-july-fourth-party-going/18Co0UNOEiR1PEk0I9gjHO/story.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 (edited) Since you keep mentioning 10th, here is some context. Back in 1987, the Garfield Cadets lost to Spirit of Atlanta three times in June/July, yet it was Garfield that won DCI and Spirit that finished 10th. This was simply a case of one corps improving much more than another during the season, and judges calling it as it happened. Now, if corps are so much better today, the margins between them should be narrower. Why would we expect less movement between corps? Should be more. I use 10th only as a number say 12th pick anyone you want. Corps today for sure are more consistent than ever before. Higher levels from top to bottom. There's no denying that. If you need to go back 20 years to prove a point on anything, as many love to do( not saying you at all ) and sometimes even further than that the point is moot imo. 20 years plus ago is just that , a lifetime ago.. BUT you are also proving a point that I had mentioned about a corps knowing what to do, how to improve , did you come out and had no room for improvement, did all the ducks line up. What were the dynamics that put SOA in their position in the beginning then the end . Its a good conversation and maybe needs it's own thread unless were still talking about BAC. Seems to have drifted a bit. Edited October 4, 2016 by GUARDLING Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liahona Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 I use 10th only as a number say 12th pick anyone you want. Corps today for sure are more consistent than ever before. Higher levels from top to bottom. There's no denying that. If you need to go back 20 years to prove a point on anything as many love to do sometimes and sometimes even further than that the point is moot imo. 20 years plus go is just that , a lifetime ago.. BUT you ae also proving a point that I had mentioned about a corps knowing what to do, how to improve , did you come out and had no room for improvement, did all the ducks line up. What were the dynamics that put SOA in their position in the beginning then the end . Its a good conversation and maybe needs it's own thread unless were still talking about BAC. Seems to have drifted a bit. I think a lot of the conversation was concerning the importance of coming out of the gate strong...the fact that we had to dig 20 years to find an example to undo that...actually supports your assertion anyway IMO. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 I think a lot of the conversation was concerning the importance of coming out of the gate strong...the fact that we had to dig 20 years to find an example to undo that...actually supports your assertion anyway IMO. Yes Today's lower placing corps is not the lower placing corps of even 10 years ago let alone 20, 30 or 40 years back in time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liahona Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 (edited) I would argue that 1987 was a completely different landscape than DCI today. The shows are infinitely more demanding, far more moving pieces, and to be honest the level of competitiveness in the 6-15 range is incomparable. Today, it is remarkable to accomplish what Academy did—which was to make finals after competing in the low teens for the early part of the season. There have been a few of this phenomena over the last several years that still amaze me...I'm probably forgetting some others I'm sure... Boston Crusaders 1998 15th Boston Crusaders 1999 9th Carolina Crown 2002 16th Carolina Crown 2003 10th Troopers 2008 16th Troopers 2009 12th The Academy 2015 15th The Academy 2016 11th Edited October 4, 2016 by Liahona Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeRapp Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 Yes Today's lower placing corps is not the lower placing corps of even 10 years ago let alone 20, 30 or 40 years back in time I would also guess that the sheer number of people on staff at any of the World Class corps dwarfs the staffs of 20 years ago. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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