perc2100 Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 It's quite a long post to be from a "troll" but that's just my opinion. I felt the guy was stating how he feels That could be. I generally categorize trolls as someone who starts a topic as a blatant counter-argument to a forum (such as a "I don't like DCI World Class drum corps" topic in a DCI World Class drum corps forum), and then having actual, intelligent discourse doesn't reply to anyone's counter arguments. THAT is a discussion. You saying "I love Lincoln Continentals for these reasons," me replying, "I dislike Lincolns for these reasons, and prefer this alternative for these reasons" = a friendly discussion of disagreement. Saying "Lincoln Continentals are ginormous boats with wheels that really suck" and then not adding to the discussion = likely trolling. Had the OP debated with people with dissenting opinions, I would agree that he's not trolling. Since he hasn't, well, you know the seeing: If it sounds like a troll and stinks like a troll, it's likely a troll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 It generally isn't a huge issue, and I don't have a problem with people expressing their opinions. But this year's griping seems to have been taken to a whole new level. Maybe I'm just suffering from "alumniof fatigue" and am overly sensitive to people starting a topic to gripe about every last negative thought that popped into their head. It's weird how trombones and sousaphones and concert F-horns have REALLY driven people seemingly over the edge of discontent on DCP. I get those who dislike electronics & mic'ing as that is fairly radical change. But t-bones, sousas, whatever are still just different brass instruments. I thought it was MORE goofy (stupid) that when DCI changed to any-key brass the specifically outlawed trombones when previously corps could (and did) use G-keyed valved, slideless trombones. This new rule change really seems to have sent people so furious that their best sense of recourse is to not go to a show they might not have attended in years + complain on a forum. "This is the winter of our discontent" indeed... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 Mellodude isn't a DCI apologist. He is actually the exact opposite of his sig... See no "good". Hear no "good". Speak no "good". I was referring to Mello Dude seemingly calling ME out as a DCI apologist, not me calling him a DCI apologist: which is, as you state, VERY apparent. Again, he was unable to quote anyone in his reply so it's a bit unclear of his intent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sutasaurus Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 Here's what I see: someone posts they don't like the product for any of a number of reasons. And what do we get in reply? A discussion of why someone likes the product? No. We get ad hominem attacks. That says a lot about who really is the childish person. Well put sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 Good point. I forgot the "this is why all important summer band movers and shakers don't take DCP seriously" that gets added to the replies. So afraid that someone might agree that you have to dismiss the entire forum. Another nice tactic borrowed from the political class. "Political class?" What does that mean?!?! As for the rest of what you say, 1) there are obviously plenty of people who agree with me, 2) there are obviously plenty of people who disagree with me. Therefor I could care less who disagrees or agrees. I was pointing out that posts like the OP's trolling, and others' repeated "OMG the activity is awful yet I constantly partake in discussion about this activity" types posts are reasons why DCP is not taken seriously * note: I also do not take it seriously - does anyone take any internet forum seriously?! For every post like, the post someone started yesterday wanting to hear stories about alumni who are thriving in non-music fields, or posts like the person asking for ideas on what drum corps shows would be good to show to newbies for a project he's working on bringing the activity to newbies in a public library, there are several more (seemingly FAR more at times) post like the trollish OP post. I LOVE talking about actual drum corps. I LOVE debating judging criteria, design merits, who's best and why, etc. I LOATHE addressing the repeated dead-horse beating garbage of "I can't stand the activity" that comes across as nothing more than a ten year old throwing a temper tantrum: those discussions add NOTHING to the conversation, add no substance to the discussion of World Class DCI, and don't have much logical reason to exist on this forum. FWIW I get in moods where sometimes I let this nonsense waste my time, while other times I just blow it off and ignore it. Guess maybe I'm in the frustrated by nonsense phase, so hopefully I'll swing back to the "ignore" phase sooner than later then we can go back to ignoring each other Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeN Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 I don't want another reason to stay home and watch FN in my underwear. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 Here's what I see: someone posts they don't like the product for any of a number of reasons. And what do we get in reply? A discussion of why someone likes the product? No. We get ad hominem attacks. That says a lot about who really is the childish person. I guess that's one way of looking at it. You can also look at the OP starting a dead-horse beating ad hominem attack of the World Class DCI activity in the World Class DCI forum and immediately bailing from the thread with no more discussion. As for a discussion on why someone likes the product, there are a PLETHORA of other topics that talk about that: actual, intelligent discourse, friendly debates on judging criteria & favorite designs, etc. If you can't see those perhaps you're blinded by your agenda. We can tag names on each other if you want I guess: this is the internet after all. If you're aim is discrediting, though, it diminishes your entire argument and delves into eye-rolling "ignore user" territory though. I get guilty of that as well at times. This thread is essentially the epitome of childish all around, I think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 I don't want another reason to stay home and watch FN in my underwear. Well, just don't get your show-watching venues mixed up when you are in your underwear! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Windish Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 Well, just don't get your show-watching venues mixed up when you are in your underwear! I don't know, MikeD. Seems to be lots of "panties in a wad." going on here! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slingerland Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 (edited) Sadly, more of those are made and sold than DCI finals DVD's. You're right. That is sad. You know what would be sadder? For those artists who actually have something to say and an interest in pushing themselves to try something new to stop doing what they're doing, because, after all, the kitten and clown patrons out there will never appreciate the work. Working toward the lowest common denominator because a big chunk of the potential audience has no interest in being challenged never leads to anything worth knowing. One of the whole points of reading, watching, or looking and listening to the work of creative artists IS to have your preconceptions changed and your tastes challenged. What would be better would be for those who don't care for something to ask themselves WHY they don't like it - and do so from the standpoint that it's perfectly OK to come to the conclusion that you didn't like something not because it was strange, but because the artist in question failed to do the thing that he or they were trying to do. I think that's the real problem in drum corps now, from an artistic standpoint. It's not the shows are too artsy, it' s that with too many cases, they're failing to deliver the goods. Edited March 14, 2014 by Slingerland 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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