emc2 Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 Well, OK, so let's concede "defeat" and presume that WW do become normal field instrumentation in drum corps. The question begs, then what? We already know you (and many others) will stop attending but, more likely than not, the instrumentation will open the activity to a whole new crop of MM's who have never been able to do summer professional marching band (DCI) before. Along with them will come their parents, relatives, and band friends buying up the tickets that you and others stop buying. Will drum corps die as a result of WW? I doubt it. Will WW draw a new crop of fans mostly excluded until then? Likely, IMO. Break it into two division 1) Bando WW. 2) Drum corps with out WW. They Amp sound in any way. They can perform at the same show in their division. Just saying. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 I will try to answer this briefly (but in doing so, risk having every phrase challenged in counterposts). Historically, competitive drum corps has had a unique audience draw unlike that of marching band. However, competitive marching band has had a uniquely larger participant base for whatever amount of time there have been 4,000 such bands. If DCI waits long enough to make this change, generations of that participant base should provide enough of an audience to sustain DCI as a band circuit. Making that change too soon would be certain death for DCI. (Imagine 1972, for example.) How long is "long enough"? I think 2030 would be safe. 2010 would have been too early, IMO. In between? Not sure... but I suspect we will find out, firsthand. We agree, and this is a point that I was keeping in my quiver to bring out if the needed. You made the point nicely. The DCI "Who Are You" study done by Vaticinate 3 years ago (I think, maybe 4? Time flies...) showed that the average duration of today's drum corps fans is less than three years. So your point (and mine) is very valid that the fan base turnover will likely produce very short memories very quickly. I would suggest the transformation has already occurred and that most fans in the stands today (the DCP fanbase mostly excepted) has no idea of G horns, grounded equipment, or analog no-amped sound. Frankly, I'd think most of them are wondering why there are no clarinets or saxes on the field even as they appreciate (by may not understand why) the extra sound coming from the brass (and amps...ahem). I just don't think the activity will put the genie back in the bottle, even if I'd prefer they leave the cork in it on WW's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 Sure, the directors can play at being Lewis Carroll's Humpty-Dumpty, but that doesn't mean they're right. If George Hopkins decides to tell you that the Cleveland Orchestra is now a drum corps, because he and his fellows have decided it is so, are you going to believe him? Well, i would guess that ALL of their members are overage, so they'd need to compete in DCA. If the powers that be decided that an orchestra would be a legal entity, and if they came out and marched...why not? If they set up chairs and just played...they might get a nice music score, but not a lot in the way of visual. On the other hand... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 My concern would be having to drop the number of brass to accommodate the incoming woodwinds. My own personal preference is that there should be an "anything goes" division with no instrumentation and size limits, for any organization that chooses to add things like a full WW section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 The DCI "Who Are You" study done by Vaticinate 3 years ago (I think, maybe 4? Time flies...) showed that the average duration of today's drum corps fans is less than three years. Wow, I thought the Catholic Church pulled away from drum corps decades ago. I did not know that the Vatica.....oh wait...never mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cappybara Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 Remember when we were told that trombones would only be a solo/cameo instrument, and no one would ever march a section of them in the drill? Or how pit amplification was over $10,000 just to get into the game, so only full size corps would ever use it? How about Bb/F brass being "optional"? Every one of these equipment rule change proposals has been preceded by people "in the know" telling me there is nowhere near the support needed to pass. When that proposal does come in a few years, there will still be people insisting it has no chance of passing, nothing to see here, blah blah blah. (And please, spare us the silly argument about maintenance. Bands all over the country use woodwinds in every conceivable climate. Nowhere do you see a circuit where bands omit woodwinds because it is too hot/too cold/too dry/too wet. Ultimately, they will be used no matter what the maintenance burden. Look at the burden we already have. Just watch the corps setting up, with props and stages carried by additional trailers and/or dozens of corps members, while others carry the multiple brass instruments they will swap in/out during the show, lugging huge speakers, running dozens of cables in two minutes flat. You think these same corps will balk at woodwinds because that would require too much extra care?) Are you really comparing the maintenance of a HS woodwind after 2 hours of rehearsal 3 times a week to a drum corps rehearsing for 5-6 times more a day??? Let me tell you, I marched piccolo in high school. Do you know how many times I had to have the pads changed due to moisture each season? 4. Do you know how many times I had a broken spring or stuck key? Pretty often. And that's just in high school, with a piccolo. Start adding in saxophones, clarinets, etc and in a drum corps environment, it will add up. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cajal Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 (edited) . Edited July 21, 2016 by cajal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 Wow, I thought the Catholic Church pulled away from drum corps decades ago. I did not know that the Vatica.....oh wait...never mind. I am guessing that you won't be called back as a consultant either for Pioneer or Marian Catholic... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 Wow, I thought the Catholic Church pulled away from drum corps decades ago. I did not know that the Vatica.....oh wait...never mind. You are forgiven, my son. (Well, in your case where you don't buy green bananas, "son" is probably not the right name to use. ) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKSuperman Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 (edited) Are you really comparing the maintenance of a HS woodwind after 2 hours of rehearsal 3 times a week to a drum corps rehearsing for 5-6 times more a day??? Let me tell you, I marched piccolo in high school. Do you know how many times I had to have the pads changed due to moisture each season? 4. Do you know how many times I had a broken spring or stuck key? Pretty often. And that's just in high school, with a piccolo. Start adding in saxophones, clarinets, etc and in a drum corps environment, it will add up. I'm sorry, but I have to speak up. As a fellow woodwind player, I have to make the observation that you must have not have taken care of your pic very well. I marched 6 years (7th-12th grade), with the same pic player for 4 of those years. She had to have her pads replaced twice and springs once. I played Alto, Tenor, Bari, Bb Clarinet, Bass Clarinet, and Sousaphone (I went wherever I was needed). 5 woodwind instruments in 5 years. Not once did any of those pads need replaced, springs were replaced on the Bari once. If you know how to take care of the instrument, it won't cost you nearly as much in upkeep. We didn't practice 2 hours a day 3 times a week either, let me tell you. We practiced Monday through Friday, 3 to 8. Rain or shine. Did you know for moisture all you have to do is take a piece of paper, put it under the pad, and press down on the key? The paper will soak all of the moisture in the pad, helping your pads live longer. Did you know they make "spring oil", which costs slightly less than valve oil, which in turn, keeps your springs alive? With the proper care by the player, woodwinds don't cost nearly as much in upkeep as one would think. *Disclaimer* This does not mean that I condone woodwinds in DCI. Just tired of the shade being thrown towards woodwinds for upkeep costs. Edited July 21, 2016 by UKSuperman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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