C.Holland Posted December 15, 2016 Share Posted December 15, 2016 What evidence do you have to support this assertion?...I personally am NOT a fan of a big spectacle to be honest...I miss the days when good ole marching, spinning, and playing would carry the day...but at the same time I do embrace change...just not necessarily ALL of it all the time... who is the target audience of DCI currently? potential members? age outs? or the general populace? I always remember DCI groups doing what marching band did, but had more advanced shows in all things on the field. (playing, spinning, marching, dancing, props..etc) They used all sorts of things to tell the story on the field and to give you a bigger wow effect than you got from fall marching groups. And to understand who's really buying the most tickets, I can't say because I don't have that data. But I'm going to guess its the marching band world, who aren't going to pay to see something that's on the same level that they've seen in the fall. And they aren't going to audition for something that's not as challenging as what they come from. Why would they? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeN Posted December 15, 2016 Share Posted December 15, 2016 Honestly, the audience is marching band kids (potential members) and their families. And as much as it pains me to admit it, that was the correct decision for DCI to make years ago. Mike 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted December 15, 2016 Share Posted December 15, 2016 OK, I'll bite. I'm a HS music teacher, father or two (one a frosh in HS), and 40. I marched DCI WC drum corps in the late 90s and have been a DCI fan since I learned of its existence in 1990 when I was a frosh in HS. LOVE shows from the 80s, early-mid 90s, etc. I wouldn't call myself a dinosaur per say, but I have an affection for shows that were performed long before I knew what DCI is (there are some 70s shows I also like, but not nearly as many as 80s-on). Now that we got my perspective out of the way... Right now there are not a lot of audiences who want to see simple marching/playing/spinning on the field anymore: audience want to see some sort of big production of music, visual (not just marching or equipment work). Audiences want multi-media stuff, they want pop-culture references, they want circus-type environment. If you see any sort of big summer concert, music is not just a band plugged into amps and doing their thing: there are screens, lighting coordination, maybe lasers and smoke or fire, etc. We still have traditional symphonies, but many of them also incorporate modern "awe" factors into their shows (maybe not every weekend, but at times they'll show stuff on screens behind the symphony, do a multi-media type thing or educational "lecture" type of thing during a performance, etc). Even at the dawn of, say, 'moving pictures' before color or sound movie exhibitors added live music accompaniment to make the pictures more exciting, even when the pictures were cool space locations, gun fighting, train wrecks, etc. The audience currently seems to want big productions, and that's what DCI is providing them. Synths and speakers to give the sound more depth or interesting alternative music effects (such as sampled dialogue from a movie or other cool FX); props to enhance a visual idea more or to just flat-out entertain (like Bluecoats did last year); maybe we'll eventually see coordinated lighting effects or screens used to display imagery during a show. In answer to your question I would say no, it's not enough. That's not what the kids see on TV watching musical programs, that's not what kids see at HS marching band competitions or WGI events. It's what they likely expect out of modern DCI. It seemed last summer Bluecoats were almost undisputed crowd favorites not just because they performed well, but because they performed well AND had those crazy ramps to up the entertainment value. As with anything, sometimes this stuff works (2016 Bluecoats) and sometimes it doesn't work as well (2016 Cadets w/the statue guys on wedding cakes or whatever ). That can be said about ALL elements of a DCI show, only in these cases far easy-to-indentafy aspects other than, say, percussion arrangements. We've always taken the good with the bad though. And when this stuff works well it works amazing for the audience. I'd personally MUCH prefer the "cheese" or "goofiness" or whatever adjective used to describe Bluecoats 2016 than the same cheese and goofiness for Phantom 08. One, IMO, was far more inspiring and original, and one felt like clown-hand GE. agree 100% and as I said earlier on the subject,. as someone who interviews potential members for a very long time, summer, winter and yes even fall Ive yet to hear " WOW you guys march so cool or what a clean corps. Now I do hear I love the percussion program or music program BUT not without a follow up with production wow's,. travel, style etc etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted December 15, 2016 Author Share Posted December 15, 2016 Honestly, the audience is marching band kids (potential members) and their families. And as much as it pains me to admit it, that was the correct decision for DCI to make years ago. Mike Yep. Period. End of story. Three year average participation. Three year average fan-dom. It's like a perpetual up-escalator of new kids and fans coming up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Dixon Posted December 15, 2016 Share Posted December 15, 2016 Yep. Period. End of story. Three year average participation. Three year average fan-dom. It's like a perpetual up-escalator of new kids and fans coming up. or like a RAMP ;-) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted December 15, 2016 Author Share Posted December 15, 2016 who is the target audience of DCI currently? potential members? age outs? or the general populace? I always remember DCI groups doing what marching band did, but had more advanced shows in all things on the field. (playing, spinning, marching, dancing, props..etc) They used all sorts of things to tell the story on the field and to give you a bigger wow effect than you got from fall marching groups. And to understand who's really buying the most tickets, I can't say because I don't have that data. But I'm going to guess its the marching band world, who aren't going to pay to see something that's on the same level that they've seen in the fall. And they aren't going to audition for something that's not as challenging as what they come from. Why would they? I don't think you addressed liahonia's point, which was to refute the contention that there are not many audiences around who want to watch "traditional" marching, spinning, etc. Your point is that drum corps is, has been, and should be at a higher level than marching band which no one has contested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted December 15, 2016 Author Share Posted December 15, 2016 or like a RAMP ;-) Touche. Well played, you sh--. But are you just describing Hop's vision for this year's zag? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ouooga Posted December 15, 2016 Share Posted December 15, 2016 Honestly, the audience is marching band kids (potential members) and their families. And as much as it pains me to admit it, that was the correct decision for DCI to make years ago. Mike Yep. Period. End of story. Three year average participation. Three year average fan-dom. It's like a perpetual up-escalator of new kids and fans coming up. That's a retention problem then. Assuming that's true (and I really do assume it is) then DCI literally has an unlimited stream of new audience members coming in, and they're marketing to them well since y-o-y attendance is increasing, but after a few years they stop caring. Engage/retain. I mean, I'm sure high school football players are big NFL fans, but they don't lose interest after high school. This audience should be no different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monoemono Posted December 16, 2016 Share Posted December 16, 2016 Bluecoats are a perfect example of good and bad usage... However in 2015 when they performed Kinetic Noise, it was absolutely dreadful. The electronics were used to cover up the dreadful hornline(sorry, I have seen horn videos where you can actually hear the performance of the hornline) Is this the "dreadful hornline" you're referring to? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sIRdkW6okkE I can see why they chose to "cover up" that hornline. Those tricky 'Coats.... People sure do say some..."interesting" stuff on this forum sometimes. (June video, BTW) 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Holland Posted December 16, 2016 Share Posted December 16, 2016 That's a retention problem then. Assuming that's true (and I really do assume it is) then DCI literally has an unlimited stream of new audience members coming in, and they're marketing to them well since y-o-y attendance is increasing, but after a few years they stop caring. Engage/retain. I mean, I'm sure high school football players are big NFL fans, but they don't lose interest after high school. This audience should be no different. yes and no. I think many age out, and then go to shows to see the corps they marched. But they aren't making many trips to Indy unless its cost effective and works with their schedule. I've talked with a few who aged out four and five years ago, who come to indy or the larger shows more now that they've gotten out of college and have real jobs. I also think the alumni organizations play a big part of this by tailgating and creating meet ups at all the the shows. It gives the age outs something to travel for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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