luv4corps Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 Drum corps is not technically a sport BUT it seems to me to be very similar to figure skating, which IS a sport. In figure skating, routines are judged on artistic quality and technical components, just like drum corps. Music choice, drill/choreography/interpretive movement, ease of flow, tricks, execution - both skating and drum corps depend on these elements to score high. The difference is, in skating, a top ranked skater could flub one or more Axels or Lutzes that would severely affect his or her score, whereas in drum corps, those big train wrecks just don't happen, or if they do, with, say a missed rifle catch, it only involves a member or two, and doesn't ruin the whole performance enough to tank the score. IMO that is why the pecking order remains fairly locked all season. I sometimes wish huge upsets would happen regularly as well. Once in awhile they do, but it is certainly not common. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfrontz Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 1 minute ago, mfrontz said: Just a different take - if the results were markedly different every night the complaining would be MUCH more intense. What reason would the judges give? 'I like this show better?' How would the staff and kids know what they needed to do to improve? A relative consistency in judging is necessary not only for educational reasons but also for trust in the competitive aspect of the activity. You have to have a relative consistency of adjudication in order to have a night when a competitive result that is different than predicted can happen once in a while and be trusted. Granted, this leads to 'writing the program for the judging sheets' but this is simply the price that is paid for having a rubric which is as fair as possible for all corps. Plus, you can't write a program that can't be executed by the performers you have. The two go together. In regard to 'one corps can't be consistently far superior night after night' I think the performers are so disciplined and mature these days that really you don't have a whole lot of outlier shows. There can still be such a thing as a 'bad run' but in general the performance level is pretty consistent night after night. Championships week is a little different. If you are looking for an exciting show, watch semis. That's a show when standings can move, especially from the 13th to 12th spot. Finals can also be interesting because a corps stuck in one spot can move up if they are loose and have a great show and the corps above them is tense or slightly off. Granted, a corps slipping from first to second is rare, but it does happen, and if I had time, I could come up with statistics. Off the top of my head...times when a corps leading coming into championship week has not placed first (or has placed first but was tied) 1988 Blue Devils (Madison Scouts) 1992 Star of Indiana (Cavaliers) 1995 Blue Devils (Cavaliers) 1996 Blue Devils (Phantom Regiment - tie) 1999 Blue Devils (SCV - tie) 2000 Cadets (Cavaliers - tie) 2008 Blue Devils (Phantom Regiment) 2013 Blue Devils (Carolina Crown) 2015 Carolina Crown (Blue Devils) I'm sure there are more before 1988... and I may have missed some Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fran Haring Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 You want predictability? Try being a Mets, Jets, and Nets fan. It's a stone lock that those teams will somehow find a way to screw up a good thing. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThirdValvesAreForWimps Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 The modern DCI Rules have taken the burden of performance from the performers and placed it in the hands of the sound man at the mixing board. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThirdValvesAreForWimps Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 21 minutes ago, mfrontz said: Off the top of my head...times when a corps leading coming into championship week has not placed first (or has placed first but was tied) 1988 Blue Devils (Madison Scouts) 1992 Star of Indiana (Cavaliers) 1995 Blue Devils (Cavaliers) 1996 Blue Devils (Phantom Regiment - tie) 1999 Blue Devils (SCV - tie) 2000 Cadets (Cavaliers - tie) 2008 Blue Devils (Phantom Regiment) 2013 Blue Devils (Carolina Crown) 2015 Carolina Crown (Blue Devils) I'm sure there are more before 1988... and I may have missed some 1978 Phantom Regiment (Santa Clara Vanguard) 1980 27th Lancers (Blue Devils) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lance Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 2 minutes ago, ThirdValvesAreForWimps said: The modern DCI Rules have taken the burden of performance from the performers and placed it in the hands of the sound man at the mixing board. Individual performance quality is pretty amazing, actually. Just keeps getting better and better. With regard to he actual topic, rubric-based scoring attempts to be more objective than holistic scoring, whether we're talking about "judging" the quality of an essay or a dci show. All the rubric really does is break holistic scoring into several categories. It's not really objective at all. The idea of scoring dci performances is pretty silly to me. It wasn't always like that for me, but I've grown or something. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
queenanne_1536 Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 10 hours ago, Bluzes said: No mystery, intrigue, suspense or surprises. While I agree with this. Whom do you think was unfairly placed? By and large I think the judges get it right. Back in the 80s most members seem to be local, or at least within reasonable driving distance - of course where I marched we had members from even Europe, but most were regional. That's not the case any more. I also think memberships, at least in the top corps, are much more made up of serious musicians and dancers, who want to make a career out of their art. I never did. The last time I played the trumpet/soprano was '89 finals. I was done after that. I didn't and don't miss it. Someone who wants to make a career out of it, isn't going to age out in a non-finalist or lower tier corps if they have the talent. They want to age out with the Blue Devils, Bluecoats, or Vanguard to name a few. I bet these three, and a few others see a lot of members from many lower placing corps. When you can't keep your talent, it's hard to move up. Yes, it's super boring these days, competitively. But it's the way it is. I also think pro sports are rigged in the playoffs - so there's that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluzes Posted July 24, 2018 Author Share Posted July 24, 2018 27 minutes ago, mfrontz said: Just a different take - if the results were markedly different every night the complaining would be MUCH more intense. Thank you for trying to strengthen my knowledge. Although life has thrown a few curves we have been to most dci finals and to a lesser extent DCA, Legion & VFW nationals. Was just thinking this morning back in the day I would not have been surprised that the VFW convention was in KC. Now all I get is traffic jams because of the prez attending.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeanInChicago Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 This topic reminds me of ordering a pizza. A thin-crust pepperoni is almost always going to win. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, luv4corps said: The difference is, in skating, a top ranked skater could flub one or more Axels or Lutzes that would severely affect his or her score, whereas in drum corps, those big train wrecks just don't happen, or if they do, with, say a missed rifle catch, it only involves a member or two, and doesn't ruin the whole performance enough to tank the score. IMO that is why the pecking order remains fairly locked all season. Also, in DCI Drum Corps not all "missed, botched solos " are handled the same either. For example, if a solo is totally flubbed and becomes a " train wreck " ( as you said ) due to an engineering malfunction ( an adult creativity ) during the show, DCI judges will overlook this. However, if a performer solo is similarly flubbed in execution and delivery, and thus becomes a " train wreck" the DCI judges will take a far less forgiving stance on these types of botched solos in the points they will then assign. Edited July 24, 2018 by BRASSO 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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