fsthnds Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 6 hours ago, ECJ94 said: I just watched the video above and I agree, the shopping cart was in bad taste as well as a potential hazard to the member in it as well as members around it, but the underlying thing that I can't help but note.... Back when there used to be a full retreat at every show, members were taught early how to maintain proper decorum during retreat. That seems to be missing these days. Yes, we all remember flying elbows during the pass through, but the shenanigans ended on the track. Once you were back on the field, all games came to an end. The staff wasn't on the field to police your actions, the veteran membership did that. Now, the veteran members don't even know how to act. Perhaps full retreats should be occurring more often? Perhaps regional should have full retreats so that the members start learning what is expected of them before they get to finals?? The issue started when the "shopping cart" was used to bring "liquid" refreshments into the tent when the units were lining up for the retreat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IllianaLancerContra Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 1 minute ago, fsthnds said: The issue started when the "shopping cart" was used to bring "liquid" refreshments into the tent when the units were lining up for the retreat. I would suggest the issue started when the [supposedly] responsible adult leadership allowed the ‘shopping cart with refreshments’ on the trip in the first place. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
84BDsop Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 3 hours ago, Lead said: 1998 retreat in somewhere, Midwest: Glassmen Horn Sergeant A.F.: "GLASSMEN HORNLINE - HORNS DOWN IN 4... 1, 2, ready, move... 1-2-3-4!" Cavaliers (next to us) Horn Sergeant: "CAVALIERS HORNLINE - HORNS DOWN IN 64... 1, 2, ready, move... 1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-190-11-12-13-14-15-16-17-18-19-20-21-22-23-24-25-26-27-28-29-30-31-32-33-34-35-36-37-38-39-40-41-42-43-44-45-46-47-48-49-50-51-52-53-54-55-56-57-58-59-60-61-62-63-64" That was probably hell on the contras!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scheherazadesghost Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 8 hours ago, MarimbaManiac said: While I agree this is a bit of a stretch, I know a few things to be true: This type of behavior is indicative of the culture of the organization, which usually flows from the top (or the people at the top turn a blind eye to it). Due to the severity, this likely wasn't the first incident like this. Vanguard has a history of hiring problematic admins/staff. Fair or not, Vanguard MUST avoid even the perception of malfeasance right now. In my opinion needs to fire her, make a strong statement they don't support that kind of behavior, and clean house of anyone with even a WHIFF of inappropriate actions while they're at it. I also just generally feel like they need to clean house anyways, but I digress. Is there a scenario in which you would accept current leadership? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sutasaurus Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 4 minutes ago, 84BDsop said: That was probably hell on the contras!! Contras weren’t the rockstars then as they are today. Just sayin’. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IllianaLancerContra Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 4 minutes ago, Sutasaurus said: Contras weren’t the rockstars then as they are today. Just sayin’. Speak for yourself! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sutasaurus Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 16 minutes ago, IllianaLancerContra said: Speak for yourself! LOL! I am! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TOC Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 (edited) 51 minutes ago, Sutasaurus said: Contras weren’t the rockstars then as they are today. Just sayin’. Wonder what Hook'em has to say about this. Edited June 7, 2023 by TOC 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbass598 Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 Since people are trying to connect SCV to this event, are there any staff that taught elsewhere so those corps can be blamed too? What about the members who marched other corps? I know some were out there. Do we blame those corps too for not teaching their members how to act? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 23 hours ago, scheherazadesghost said: I'm definitely not diminishing individual responsibility. I know and care for alum who made bad, youthful decisions when we were younger. It just doesn't strike me as good leadership to place greater accountability on the young adult member than the full adult staffers, especially when safety was at risk. Are we seriously saying everyone nearby on staff thought the grocery cart was a good idea or somehow just didn't see it at all? Either way, accountability goes beyond training and most corps could use a thorough update to their substance use violation policies and protocols. The activity has quite a legacy on the matter and continuing to shuffle accountability never helps. i think it's both. in your youth did adults tell you not to do something then you went and did it anyway? I did. i'll be honest....who even knows if staff knew about the cart? I know when my kids walked on the floor several years ago i didn't know they beads and baubles and stuff. granted thats far more tame, but still staff aren't all knowing. and once it's on the floor staff may not have access to get out there and get the cart removed. again...not absolving the staff.....but they can't be everywhere and see everything either. in fact sometimes being a helicopter staff member leads to bigger issues later 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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