Tom Brace Posted September 17, 2010 Share Posted September 17, 2010 ...and all this mumbo-jumbo about Pioneer getting screwed up the jaxie in '96 and being forced into Division I? That's just hilarious! Pioneer totally had the talent and the size to move up; as usual, it was poor programming that did them in. This. When their program is strong top to bottom, the corps does better. When it is...as it was last year...it was not difficult to tell where they would finish. Either them or the Northwest corps was going to finish last and 'scades decided to get better enough not to finish last. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PioneerWebmaster Posted September 18, 2010 Share Posted September 18, 2010 pioneer not care about winning? you don't know the Pioneer I marched in 96.The same '96 Pioneer corps that I observed going through the motions on finals night and getting beat, fair-and-square, by a feisty little corps from Quebec with more drive, determination, passion, and innovation? Pioneer wasn't going to win that year just based on thier size. Pioneer carried over a lot of talent, and corps size, going into the '97 and '98 seasons and what did they do with that talent? A watered down Riverdance production and an ultra-cheesy, blat heavy, Irish In Your Face program the following year. I've mostly avoided this thread for a variety of reasons, but I have to respond to this... To say that the 1996 corps "went through the motions" on finals night is completely false. If you had said that we went through the motions earlier that day at prelims, it may have been more believable. Nobody in their right minds thought that Les Etoiles was going to make up 6+ points in 5 days to catch us at prelims. I still don't believe it was possible because we've never seen the feat accomplished again. Thus all of the conspiracy talk that creeps up anytime you discuss the 1996 season with someone who marched with Pioneer that year. Throughout the whole season it was implied that we didn't belong in Division 2 by many people in various positions. How does it look when a 6 point spread closes in a matter of a couple days? What would you think if you were a member of that corps? If anything, our eyes the last weeks of the season were on the corps that were directly ahead of us in Division 1. We left the last regional of the season in Allentown seeded in 14th place in Division 1, but lost that seeding at Quarterfinals because we were still in Division 2. Nevertheless, we had our eyes on 13th place and on possibly even being top 12 and were rehearsing our rear ends off trying to get there. We wanted to be the first corps to march all four nights. But I digress... At Division 2 finals night, all eyes were on the mission. There wasn't a single person in that corps that "went through the motions" that night. There wasn't a single person on that field at Grand Finale that wasn't devastated when the scores were announced. And there wasn't a single person that didn't go out and march their rear ends off at quarterfinals because we thought we still had a legitimate shot at least at making semifinals and sure the heck wanted to get revenge against the corps that had beaten us. In the end, we ended up 20th. It is what it is.... You pick yourself up and move on. 1997 - Not really watered down, but definitely could have been pulled off better. In hindsight, design definitely was an issue. But watered down? Our brass book that year had more notes than some corps play in a couple seasons combined. Things just didn't work out the way that we would have liked. It is what it is.... You pick yourself up and move on. 1998 - Irish in Your Face was a unique show. On the entertaining side of things, there definitely was some value there. We were the loudest corps at most shows, which back then actually meant people liked you. But in all seriousness, that year was all about entertaining the masses, which we definitely accomplished. Could we have been better? You bet, but we still thought we had a chance at semifinals that year. Ironically, this "feisty little corps" from the north passed us by again at Quarterfinals and we ended up 18th! It is what it is.... You pick yourself up and move on. The point is, the corps has always picked itself up and moved on regardless of the final outcome of the season... and I expect the same as we transition from 2010 to 2011. If anything, it has the potential to be an exciting season with the corps celebrating its 50th anniversary. Hopefully some of the attention that this thread has generated can be put to good use was we move forward with the season! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warsawstory Posted September 18, 2010 Share Posted September 18, 2010 Roundtrip airfare from Kansas City to Milwaukee, Dec. 10-12. $133.00 Frontier airlines. Book now. I'm sure there are all sorts of other goods deals from cities such as Omaha, Indy, Pittsburgh, Tampa, Dallas, etc. Just sayin' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thirdcoast Posted September 18, 2010 Share Posted September 18, 2010 So much for Tom B. getting this thread closed. I am really pulling for PIONEER this year, please dont play Irish music in 2011. Ill bet a buck they dont. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MetalTones2012 Posted September 18, 2010 Share Posted September 18, 2010 As long as there is a church every Sunday requirement...Pioneer will not get a full 150 membership. YES!!! I can tell you without any research that not everybody that marches drum corps is Christian, let alone Catholic. And even for the ones who are, religion in drum corps is a HUGE turn-off. This approach might work for an all-age or senior corps, but the fact is that many kids, especially in the high school/college age range, want nothing to do with religion. (I'm not saying all, I marched with a devout Catholic though he never minded that he couldn't go to church on tour.) It's not just about having more time to practice, I GUARANTEE that the moment Pioneer loses the church requirement they will have the highest numbers they've ever had, regardless of their scores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted September 18, 2010 Share Posted September 18, 2010 YES!!!I can tell you without any research that not everybody that marches drum corps is Christian, let alone Catholic. And even for the ones who are, religion in drum corps is a HUGE turn-off. This approach might work for an all-age or senior corps, but the fact is that many kids, especially in the high school/college age range, want nothing to do with religion. (I'm not saying all, I marched with a devout Catholic though he never minded that he couldn't go to church on tour.) It's not just about having more time to practice, I GUARANTEE that the moment Pioneer loses the church requirement they will have the highest numbers they've ever had, regardless of their scores. except there is no requirement. that's already been debunked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeZ Posted September 18, 2010 Share Posted September 18, 2010 pioneer not care about winning? you don't know the Pioneer I marched in 96.The same '96 Pioneer corps that I observed going through the motions on finals night and getting beat, fair-and-square, by a feisty little corps from Quebec with more drive, determination, passion, and innovation? Pioneer wasn't going to win that year just based on thier size. Pioneer carried over a lot of talent, and corps size, going into the '97 and '98 seasons and what did they do with that talent? A watered down Riverdance production and an ultra-cheesy, blat heavy, Irish In Your Face program the following year. I am going to stay out of the 2010/2011 Pioneer discussion, but I had to respond to this comment. You can say whatever you want about Pioneer's show and placement in 1996, but to say that "I" and the fellow "hard working members of my corps" were going through the motions is a slap in the face. 99% of what is said on DCP is opinion, and you can't argue that someones opinion is "wrong". But you said you observed us going through the motions and I was on the field that night with a baritone in my hand and I was NOT going through the motions. There may be places/times in my life that I have gone through the motions, but none of those times ever involved me marching or teaching a drumcorps. I worked and sweated with over 100 brothers and sisters EVERY day of the 1996 season and I cannot sit back and keep my mouth shut when someone says otherwise. I think it is safe to say that 1996 was the strongest corps Pioneer has ever put on the field. It upsests me that due to the 20th place finish that 1996 Pioneer routinely gets overlooked, and that there are tons of people out there that have no idea how good that corps actually was. Can Pioneer ever get back to the level they were at in 96? Yes. Will they? I don't know. Pioneer cannot be "fixed" by folks sitting behind their computers across the country. What I can do from behind my computer is encourage folks to track down a recording of Pioneer in 1996 and check out one he11 of a good drumcorps. Mike Zerhusen Pioneer bari/euph 94-98 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copyright Posted September 19, 2010 Share Posted September 19, 2010 I hope the 50th anniversary of the corps can bring many of the the alumni out of the woodwork. To stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newschool Posted September 19, 2010 Share Posted September 19, 2010 I think if Pioneer's admin just allowed it's staff do really do their job at a high level... they'd do well. It's something that is normally seen in the marching band/senior corps scene.... but some people just need to allow their creatives be creative. my 3 cents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kansan Posted September 19, 2010 Share Posted September 19, 2010 I really liked Pioneer 2010. Their show was the best Pioneer Product I've seen yet. They should have been scored higher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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