IllianaLancerContra Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 More fallout from the Hopocalypse ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 3 hours ago, garfield said: According to the 2016 990, revenue sourced to C-2 was $325,203, and expenses in that same program were $656,081. Well, there's a quick savings of over $330,000 (in 2016 dollars) from shutting down C-2. 4 minutes ago, ykw said: Yeah, 2016 looks sloppy. The 2016 form was prepared by a different CPA firm (Kreisher Miller in Horsham) than in 2014 and 2015 (Buckno Lisicky in Allentown). If you look at 2014 and 2015, USBands runs at about 475k in the black, Cadets about 350k in the red, and C2 110k in the red. But I don't think you can say eliminating C2 only generates a 110k gain, because as others have mentioned, it's likely more about selling off all the C2 assets. And, I don't think I did say that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IllianaLancerContra Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 7 hours ago, garfield said: I didn't read the announcement until just now and here are a couple of thoughts: Nowhere, in any way or any were, is there a box checked, a comment made, or a suggestion given that this $600m deficit is NOT made up entirely, or nearly entirely, of the overhanging potential liability of having to pay GH. There is at least one sentence that could, possibly indicate that it IS the same $600m: "What is known now is that on top of the financial shortfall that was inherited, and with the increased expenses incurred dealing with the previous leadership’s actions including legal fees, training fees, reductions in sponsorship and USBands participation, the organization now finds itself with an approximate $600,000 deficit." If they were being careful with their words, and I'd bet they're insisting that their financial people are being very, very careful, and "deficit" is an operating income item that has not been converted to debt. A potential liability would necessarily be addressed on the current financials, if even in the Notes to the financials according to FASB accounting standards. It would, of course, also be perfectly appropriate to make 2019 expense projections with that deficit (or servicing its debt if need be) clearly in mind. This very difficult decision says very clearly to me that this financial accounting and leadership is playing straight as an arrow by the book, making tough choices based on reality and not some pie-in-the-sky vaticination by a starry-eyed band geek. Real business, finally. Way to go, Cadets. Great move. I am not a finance guy, so please indulge (& correct me) me if I state this incorrectly: Are YEA financial gurus saying that they are treating the "GH final pay lawsuit ($600k)" as a current accounts payable, at least on paper, until the issue is civil court? If so, this could be hanging out there for a while. I am pretty sure the civil cases (GH vs YEA, & YEA vs GH) will be stayed (postponed) until the criminal counts are decided. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ykw Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 1 minute ago, garfield said: And, I don't think I did say that. What I was saying is that I don't find the breakouts in the 2016 990 to be accurate, when one compares them to 2014 and 2015. The breakouts for 2016 that you reference in Part 3 of the form, have no descriptions. When I reference the 2014 and 2015 detail, it suggests that C2 only operated at a $110k loss in those years. I'd hate for someone to think that C2 was axed to save $110k -- because I'd expect there will be a bigger impact to the bottom line from the money generated by the liquidation of C2 assets. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 2 minutes ago, IllianaLancerContra said: I am not a finance guy, so please indulge (& correct me) me if I state this incorrectly: Are YEA financial gurus saying that they are treating the "GH final pay lawsuit ($600k)" as a current accounts payable, at least on paper, until the issue is civil court? If so, this could be hanging out there for a while. I am pretty sure the civil cases (GH vs YEA, & YEA vs GH) will be stayed (postponed) until the criminal counts are decided. Well, only they can say definitively that that's the case but, again, their announcement doesn't precluded reaching that conclusion; the $600m lawsuit and $600m "deficit" (that really came up out of nowhere, AFAICT) are too coincidentally similar to not ask the question. And, just spitballing, I'd bet GH financial reserves are a lot less than even the Cadets so I'm not at all certain that the fight between them would last as long as one might expect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IllianaLancerContra Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 Just now, garfield said: Well, only they can say definitively that that's the case but, again, their announcement doesn't precluded reaching that conclusion; the $600m lawsuit and $600m "deficit" (that really came up out of nowhere, AFAICT) are too coincidentally similar to not ask the question. And, just spitballing, I'd bet GH financial reserves are a lot less than even the Cadets so I'm not at all certain that the fight between them would last as long as one might expect. Thanks & I agree re resources. But there is no way the civil cases will proceed until the criminal is resolved (consider the OJ Simpson example). There are different rules of evidence, standards, etc. It is too easy for something from the civil creeping into the criminal that could cause a mistrial - criminal standards are higher (as they should be - criminal culpability leads to loss of liberty ; civil just loss of money). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim K Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 11 minutes ago, IllianaLancerContra said: I am not a finance guy, so please indulge (& correct me) me if I state this incorrectly: Are YEA financial gurus saying that they are treating the "GH final pay lawsuit ($600k)" as a current accounts payable, at least on paper, until the issue is civil court? If so, this could be hanging out there for a while. I am pretty sure the civil cases (GH vs YEA, & YEA vs GH) will be stayed (postponed) until the criminal counts are decided. There is so much information, that in news accounts and on this site, I may be forgetting some details, but what would probably be key is whether it has to be paid in a limp sum or in increments. My thought is that where YEA is suing GH, his payout is not included in the budget and until matters are settled in court, they are probably not giving GH one cent. 1 hour ago, IllianaLancerContra said: Thanks & I agree re resources. But there is no way the civil cases will proceed until the criminal is resolved (consider the OJ Simpson example). There are different rules of evidence, standards, etc. It is too easy for something from the civil creeping into the criminal that could cause a mistrial - criminal standards are higher (as they should be - criminal culpability leads to loss of liberty ; civil just loss of money). I do know of at least one case where a college president was fired, a severance package was agreed upon. It turned out this particular president sold college property to a friend in construction. He invested in one of the projects that the company was building on the property. It all happened while he was still in charge, it was determined to be a conflict of interest which was illegal, and he had to pay back the severance he had received and lost any future benefits. On the scale of wrongdoing sexual assault is far more serious than conflict of interest. I know laws vary from state to state, but it is likely YEA has an excellent chance of not paying GH anything he has not yet received. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soccerguy315 Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 22 hours ago, dcifanforlife said: YEA Board is trying to do the impossible with the Alumni Corps. To have a successful Alumni Corps it takes longer than the six or seven months available to them. Just asked those that have done it in the past. Anaheim Kingsmen Madison Scouts, 27th Lancers. SCV and Star took close to two years to organize. Sure it is going generate interest in the Cadets and hopefully increased donations but it takes a ton of work. You have to have people working 24/7 on the project and I don't yet see that coming from YEA. Many budgets from potential sponsors for 2019 are already finalized. Many potential marching members have to have their vacation dates for 2019 already in. The devil is in the details and YEA has supplied few to date. A poorly organized Alumni Corps could harm YEA rather than help them. if they want to stand in an arc and play a few songs at Allentown, the time available should be fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grenadasmoothie Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 23 hours ago, dcifanforlife said: YEA Board is trying to do the impossible with the Alumni Corps. To have a successful Alumni Corps it takes longer than the six or seven months available to them. Just asked those that have done it in the past. Anaheim Kingsmen Madison Scouts, 27th Lancers. SCV and Star took close to two years to organize. Sure it is going generate interest in the Cadets and hopefully increased donations but it takes a ton of work. You have to have people working 24/7 on the project and I don't yet see that coming from YEA. Many budgets from potential sponsors for 2019 are already finalized. Many potential marching members have to have their vacation dates for 2019 already in. The devil is in the details and YEA has supplied few to date. A poorly organized Alumni Corps could harm YEA rather than help them. It can certainly be done. I joined the first season of Park City Pride at the first rehearsal in, IIRC, November (?), and they were certainly a "successful" alumni corps, even for their first performance the following June. In fact, for much of their existence, I'd even say they were probably the second-most-popular alumni corps among those who dig that sort of stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted November 30, 2018 Share Posted November 30, 2018 1 hour ago, grenadasmoothie said: It can certainly be done. I joined the first season of Park City Pride at the first rehearsal in, IIRC, November (?), and they were certainly a "successful" alumni corps, even for their first performance the following June. In fact, for much of their existence, I'd even say they were probably the second-most-popular alumni corps among those who dig that sort of stuff. To do it at the level of groups like 27th, SCV etc etc. I also think it needs some time. if it's to park and blow in golf shirts that's another story. I'm hoping it's more than park and blow and more in the line of those others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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