Per the California Attorney General Vanguard is operating illegally as a non profit

[Sutasaurus]

1 hour ago, IllianaLancerContra said:

I agree adults are needed - the way I (mis)read your post was that driver could do both driving and overseeing.   And I also agree with Ms S-Ghost that adult chaperones should be vetted, just like everyone else who comes in contact with members.  

We had Bus Moms” which were usually the sewing staff, not a far fetched idea.

[Jeff Ream]

15 hours ago, craiga said:

I think it has been well established that props, electronics or raised maximum members had nothing to do with Vanguard's fate, especially given the fact that they had well over 300 members on the field last summer with TWO touring drum corps.

don't use facts

[Jeff Ream]

13 hours ago, LabMaster said:

I hope that comments on how dumb DCI is for what has been happening through the years is viewed with the understanding that there is a distinction for the assigning of the “dumb” characterization should placed on either DCI the org or DCI the corps.  Both can certainly be guilty of “dumb” by not looking at the immediate and long term impact of decisions or chosen direction.  DCI the corps are mostly responsible imo as they choose what benefits the few with little regard for those who are not in a position to join in the arms race, such as membership size, touring schedule and costs, instrumentation, electronics, so on and so forth.  Some have lead the way and been successful and aren’t concerned about the have nots.  Others have found a way, over a long time.  Others just can’t seem to get it together. DCI corps still control it.  DVI org does not.  The corps chose to go to 165 members.  And it doesn’t mean you must.  Can you afford it?  Corps chose giant FE’s, (4) 18 wheelers, huge massive props, expensive staff salaries.  The key word is “chose”.  Could DCI the org stopped them?  Maybe, but likely not.  It’s not their role and DCI the corps, wouldn’t allow it.

My point is, when criticizing or blaming DCI for all the activities ills (and there are plenty),  be sure which DCI is responsible for what is being pointed out.  
 

Now back to regular programming of the failings of SCV.

DCI is the corps. the "org" is a few people hired to do what the corps want done.

[Jeff Ream]

9 hours ago, IllianaLancerContra said:

There are others on tour w/ the Corps that could fill the seats - food personnel, health personnel, instructors.   Fill the bus seats and you might be able to remove a vehicle from the convoy.  And that would save $.  

in todays world, aduts and kids together on the bus? yeah that'll end well (insert sarcasm here)

[Tim K]

19 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said:

in todays world, aduts and kids together on the bus? yeah that'll end well (insert sarcasm here)

I’m not recommending that staff and volunteers ride in the same busses as marching members, unless monies travel on their own bus, legal adults are already traveling on the same busses as kids.

[craiga]

I think some people on dcp are incredibly out of touch with the activity.   There haven't been "adult chaperones" on busses literally since the days of mom and pop drum corps when Uncle Frank would drive the 30 year old retired Greyhound coach.

Having said that, I have been told that Boston plans on not marching the full 165 in order to accommodate a couple "admin" people on each bus.  While not acting as actual chaperones,  they are nevertheless legal adults who are in constant touch with the corps leadership and are part of the reporting structure.  I believe they did this last year as well and is part of their best practices mindset.   The fact that their director is a lawyer and a former Massachusetts prosecutor may have something to do with this.  I do not know if other corps are following suit, but this sounds reasonable to me.

[waliman4444]

6 hours ago, Tim K said:

I’m not recommending that staff and volunteers ride in the same busses as marching members, unless monies travel on their own bus, legal adults are already traveling on the same busses as kids.

Are "monies" mm's that are 17 and under?...

[Sideways]

Definitely no chaperones on the buses in ‘99…bus rides were spicy!

[LabMaster]

7 hours ago, Jeff Ream said:

DCI is the corps. the "org" is a few people hired to do what the corps want done.

For sure, but it is obvious from what is posted, many posters believe that org IS the corps, and has autonomously made all the decisions affecting the entire activity, without understanding there are differences in overall functions and direction being implemented.

[IllianaLancerContra]

8 hours ago, Jeff Ream said:

in todays world, aduts and kids together on the bus? yeah that'll end well (insert sarcasm here)

Again, the SoA debacle may not have occurred had there been adult oversight on the bus.   Are you suggesting it is better to have a bunch on 16-21 year olds left to themselves for extended periods?   That has just as much potential for bad stuff to happen.  I think Ms S-Ghost’s suggestion of properly vetted staff (or admin as mentioned in the BAC comment) on the busses keeping an eye on things is a good idea.