The Cadets and GH history of sexual abuse (news article)

[BigW 2,199]

4 hours ago, 84BDsop said:

And I certainly don't want the 84 title awarded to me in that fashion.

All respect for you saying that, man. I think 99 percent or more of us would feel that way. Reminds me of when there were moves to get Jim  Thorpe back his Olympic medals, and the IOC waffled and made some silly dismissive comment to the that it was too long ago and the people who got medals wouldn't, cound't or shouldn't return them. Some very elderly Scandinavian guy came out who got the Bronze that should have been Thorpe's said he'd GLADLY give it to Thorpe's descendants because it was the right thing to do if the IOC asked him to. Totally shot down the IOC and exposed them for the goofs they are.

 

Real champs want to earn it the legit way ,not through the side porch window.

[BigW 2,199]

1 hour ago, Shewhois said:

The question about if he had contact with members in the last two months is misleading.  His harassment/assault most recently seems to have been consistently toward women who are close to his age and were employees.  Not that that makes it better but he was not preying on women 20-30 years younger than he is. I hate that I sound like I’m sticking up for him because I am NOT but could we stick to the facts as we know them and not scare the crap out of parents who have had kids in the corps by implying he is a pedophile.

True, but, in this day and age, being prudent and sensible would make it that you'd still keep him away.

[skevinp 6,562]

11 hours ago, BRASSO said:

  What ?  I just provided an example of such demands that DCI imposed on a Corps, and suspended them from DCI Competition until those demands on the part of DCI were met. The punitive damage was in essence the suspension by DCI of the Corps.until they made internal organizational infrastructure changes that satisfied the demands of DCI, and not until.  Any notion that DCI is a mere bystander in all this, and is impotent in imposing sanctions of some sort on a member Corps is both wrong, and not supported by what DCI has done in the past in situations regarding Corps internal mismanagement. If DCI does not like how a Corps is run, they have the authority to take punitive actions in emergency, unusual circumstances if the chose to. We know this as they have exercised this authority before... one example ( of others ) that I just cited were  the Troopers  DCI imposed suspension in the 2006-2007 timeframe. Few are calling for this with the Cadets, but DCI has lots of actionable things open to themselves if this is not handled properly by YEA/ Cadets.

Wasn't that decision made before 2006, though, in which case it would not have hurt members who had already embarked on their season?  And did they really call it punitive?  I thought they exercised that oversight to ensure the financial well-being of the corps.  That seems somewhat similar to DCI requiring solid financials before letting a corps become world class, and is arguably in their best interest.

For other examples you referred to earlier, were they for anything other than things (such as overage members) that gave the relevant corps an unfair competitive advantage?  In such a case, it would arguably be unfair to the other corps to allow them to compete because of that advantage.  But I don't think anyone would make the argument that the current cadets mms have a competitive advantage as a result of this devastating situation.

[garfield 7,256]

5 hours ago, JMS1995 said:

http://digital.olivesoftware.com/Olive/ODN/PhiladelphiaInquirer/Default.aspx

 

This appears to be the digital edition of the 2nd article, dated today.

I find the #meToo opinion piece on pg 9 to be particularly poignantly timed, but not finding any story on YEA!

 

Edited April 9, 2018 by garfield

[Kyle B 353]

16 hours ago, TRacer said:

DCI assessing a fine would be a tough call but I could see alumni coming together to address that ob$tacle.

I see more “sting” in the form of He Who Shall Not Be Named’s HOF induction being revoked. Championships being vacated would be another blow with no “new winner” declared in solo years (e.g., ‘87, ‘90, ‘93, etc.) and instead being noted with the dreaded asterisk while the “tie year” (‘00) would revert to the co-champion. Before I get flamed please note that while drastic this idea is not without precedent in college athletics, and since DCI bills itself as “Marching Music’s Major Leagues” internationally then drastic may be in order. 

The kids didn't do anything wrong.  GH wasn't able to clone himself 127-149 times and be the only performer on the field.  Also, not one case has been shown that any marching members were complicit.  In fact, some were his alleged victims.

 

[cixelsyd 2,701]

6 hours ago, Shewhois said:

The question about if he had contact with members in the last two months is misleading.  His harassment/assault most recently seems to have been consistently toward women who are close to his age and were employees.  Not that that makes it better but he was not preying on women 20-30 years younger than he is. 

In at least one case (Meghan Healy), there was an age difference of over 20 years.

[Fran Haring 7,760]

7 hours ago, GUARDLING said:

You are right but I'm talking about this particular issue and how it can go beyond Cadets

 

You are right about some of the wild stories.

Oh man... not to make light of a very serious issue, but that era... 60s-70s-into the 80s... a "frat house" atmosphere at times, with various people in various corps, for sure.

Not excusing any such behavior, at all. But it was a different world then.

[dans 1,226]

My wife and I attended Cadets brass camp yesterday. Had some good conversations with some people on the inside of things. Many involved with the corps right now are taking positive steps to help the Cadets move forward past this ugliness. The members seemed very upbeat and focused and glad to be there. All in all it was a really good day and we felt much better about the corps and where they are headed.

[Tim K 3,493]

12 hours ago, Shewhois said:

The MM calling for this? This hasn’t been a part of the conversation my son and his fellow members have been having. Though others may be - I can speak to what he shares with me and at no point have I heard the kids say they won’t match unless the board resigns. For the record I believe the board should but let’s not use the current members as pawns to achieve an end. They want to compete. 

 

What is said in the heat of the moment and how one feels later can be two different things. I can imagine some going to this past weekend’s camp thinking GH is not the Cadets, this is not me, I want to be a part of this corps. Let’s get to work. Others could be stating the opposite and could very well be calling for drastic measures. However, if they were at the rehearsals this weekend, they want to march. While there is much to be encouraged by with this weekend’s camp, the later full corps camp at the end of April will be key. 

Strong reactions of today’s kids is often the norm. They are sometimes judged by the “Tide Pod” kids,  but I find young people opinionated and often with informed opinions. Sometimes they are off the wall and arrogant, but let’s face it, all of us were brilliant and everyone else was an ignorant fool when we were young. We also have to remember that these kids have grown up at a time when zero tolerance has been the practice, if it is violated the ax comes down hard, and not only the perpetrator but anyone who had any knowledge can be held responsible. 

My thought: the kids do want to compete and should compete,  but a good number probably do not believe that removing GH or have the board resign solves the problem. They will expect justice for the accusers and accountability. They see #metoo! and March for our Lives (and may have even participated). They’ll want action.  

[Fred Windish 2,041]

VERY pleased to learn the Cadets had a fairly normal camp weekend. This morning, the Allentown Morning Call added a new piece to the story that speaks of a second, more apologetic message from the YEA Board.  An appropriate move, but I still believe the YEA umbrella group needs to be disbanded. The Cadets component is the utmost priority, together with its relationship to DCI.