Popular Post Poppycock Posted July 21, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted July 21, 2022 1 minute ago, MidWAmericanArts said: That being said, I completely understand the dislike of their shows. I’ve always looked at this negative differently! If given the opportunity, would one corps be able to perform another corps production equal to or better than the other. IMO BD could easily perform the Crownies show. However I don’t believe that the Crownies could perform BD’s production at the same level of achievement BD does. Never underestimate the environmental demands required in BD’s production. Just because they teach performance in a manner that make things look easy or effortlessly doesn’t mean it is. 14 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjeffeory Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 1 minute ago, Poppycock said: I’ve always looked at this negative differently! If given the opportunity, would one corps be able to perform another corps production equal to or better than the other. IMO BD could easily perform the Crownies show. However I don’t believe that the Crownies could perform BD’s production at the same level of achievement BD does. Never underestimate the environmental demands required in BD’s production. Just because they teach performance in a manner that make things look easy or effortlessly doesn’t mean it is. Are you speaking from a guard perspective? Just curious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDCorno Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 42 minutes ago, crownisking said: Hot take here. I really wish we went back to the 2021 tour model and did away with shows being judged. I hate stressing over scores, placements, spreads, etc. I don’t want to feel like any corps is the “enemy”. Last summer we were all just enjoying some really good shows. That’s it. There wasn’t the typical animosity. Different topic for a different thread, but that’s why I never refer to the marching arts as a sport. I hate the competition aspect of it. I hate what it brings out of us. In my opinion, it will be the death knell for the activity. Most of the amazing things you see and hear are based on a competitive framework. The spirit of one-upsmanship is what motivates designers and performers to constantly push the envelope on what is possible, and how well they do it. That has been the lifeblood of the activity, spanning decades prior to the DCI era. How fans, parents and members treat the competitive aspects of the activity is a different story. Competition has been so downplayed in the past couple of decades, I find the vast majority of marching members to be quite supportive of other groups and not overly obsessed with winning. There is a healthy percentage of fandom that share the same sentiment. If one is overly stressed, or a feeling the need to bash/make an enemy of groups competing with their favorite, then perhaps they need some introspection and/or therapy. it doesn’t matter if it’s Little League baseball, professional sports or DCI, there will always be people who behave badly. There isn’t much anyone can do about that other than shake their head and move on. Those types are in a distinct and small minority, but social media gives a disproportionate impression as to their presence. I think removing the one thing that has made the biggest impact on progress of the activity would be a huge mistake. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scheherazadesghost Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 (edited) . Edited June 11, 2023 by scheherazadesghost 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crownisking Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 2 minutes ago, BDCorno said: In my opinion, it will be the death knell for the activity. Most of the amazing things you see and hear are based on a competitive framework. The spirit of one-upsmanship is what motivates designers and performers to constantly push the envelope on what is possible, and how well they do it. That has been the lifeblood of the activity, spanning decades prior to the DCI era. How fans, parents and members treat the competitive aspects of the activity is a different story. Competition has been so downplayed in the past couple of decades, I find the vast majority of marching members to be quite supportive of other groups and not overly obsessed with winning. There is a healthy percentage of fandom that share the same sentiment. If one is overly stressed, or a feeling the need to bash/make an enemy of groups competing with their favorite, then perhaps they need some introspection and/or therapy. it doesn’t matter if it’s Little League baseball, professional sports or DCI, there will always be people who behave badly. There isn’t much anyone can do about that other than shake their head and move on. Those types are in a distinct and small minority, but social media gives a disproportionate impression as to their presence. I think removing the one thing that has made the biggest impact on progress of the activity would be a huge mistake. Solid points. We have BD’s dominance to thank for some really amazing shows. It is what it is. I know the judges aren’t going anywhere. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quad Aces Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Cappybara said: Out of curiosity, what is repetitive of their shows? I hear this a lot but no one seems to say WHAT exactly is repetitive. Their shows have covered such a wide range of concepts im a little confused where the repetition is And maybe it’s just me, but I don’t watch marching shows for innovation, though I guess throwing around the word “innovative” is the new DCP buzzword People seemed to enjoy shows just fine back in the 90s and 2000s without the need for “innovation” Thanks for replying and trying to have a legitimate discussion. IMHO: the use of standalone “vignettes” as movements to their show, highlighting the technical prowess of a featured soloist (a la Flight of the Bumblebee, Carnival of Venice, etc.), movements tied together by non sequitur transitions, “free form” drill design where performers hit their dot in any way that they would like in order to play the next staged section of the show, show titles that don’t really matter much, a pop/standard ballad where most of the other show music is unfamiliar to most, an obligatory hip hop/k-pop dance section, a loose narration or voiceovers in a deep mysterious voice or foreign language, vertical props to feature an entire section, etc. are what makes BD very repetitive recently. I realize that every corps uses some of the aforementioned list, but BD tends to check nearly all of these boxes every year lately. That doesn’t mean that they don’t perform what they are given very well or that the design isn’t a good layered design with lots of detail and nuances - their shows always are. And that doesn’t mean that I hate them because they win - a lot. Having been around this activity for almost 40 years, I have a ton of respect for BD. I just feel that their design team has been using the same plug and play format for a while now, and it has become boring. Obviously, everyone has their own opinion too. However, I’m not the first person to bring this up. Lastly, there was plenty of innovation in the 90s and 2000s. One glaring example is show themes and titles even didn’t take off until the early 90s. Edited July 21, 2022 by Quad Aces 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 the key is, and BD has mastered this...demand doesn't have to be repeated over and over. do it once, do it #### well, and go to a new one. BD does that. even stuff that looks similar has layers that are different than what they did that was close a minute ago. 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppycock Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 44 minutes ago, jjeffeory said: Are you speaking from a guard perspective? Just curious. No! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Guns Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 (edited) 4 hours ago, Quad Aces said: I find it interesting that a lot of the BD honks on here think that criticism of their recent show design trend has everything to do with hating them because they win, and nothing to do with their choice of show design. it’s as if since they win a lot, their show design absolutely has to be fantastic - because if you don’t agree, you hate them because they win. I don’t buy into the success breeds hate concept myself - there are plenty of activities/sports where I am a big fan of the dynasties that exist. BD can win because they have figured out how to win, but that doesn’t mean that they haven’t become repetitive, boring, dull, and lack innovation right now - it’s OK, it really is. Obviously I can't and won't speak for EVERY BD Honk. But I feel comfortable speaking for the majority of us. The problem isn't people not liking BD, or not liking the show design etc. That's fine. We like what we like. Most BD fans have zero issue with that. The problem is the people (NOT EVERYONE) that come here and regurgitate the same nonsense of BD cheating, paying off judges, having judges on the payroll, BD robbing corps of wins, and in the last 15 years have never produced a single shred of evidence and proof that BD is cheating. That's the problem. ABBD crowd says BDs shows are rinse and repeat, well so is the same crap they spew after every BD win. Regarding success breeding hate.........in a way it does. Take college football for instance............. Let an Idaho University football fan take to social media and say some disrespectful things, yea it will get some negativity, but most people won't even care or look the other way. Cause currently Idaho University isn't a threat to anyone on the college football landscape. Heck most people probably don't even know the Idaho Vandals has a team lol. However, let an Alabama Crimson Tide fan say the exact same things the Idaho fan said. That Alabama fan will have ignited an epic firestorm across social media of biblical proportions. Even though they said the same things, the difference is Alabama wins all the time, and people want to see them fail. And if the haters can't get the team to lose, they will look for anything the fanbase says and hold the team and school accountable. Edited July 21, 2022 by Chief Guns 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FTNK Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 2013 BD was awesome and should have won 2 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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