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The guy who indecently exposed himself to me got away with it. The judge was more concerned that he had a pregnant wife. Not that he was calling over children, showing them his #####, and then offering them a dollar to touch it. Not to worry. My dad got more than even with the predator. Dad was a teamster, knew the boys, guy ended up with two broken legs, sold his house and moved. I’m going to be 60 years old next month. That was no way for a young girl to see something like that.

i stopped reading through the whole thread, Stu gave me a headache. However this topic is very sensitive to me right now. Someone i considered a close friend was accused and agreed to a plea on this. a promising career as an educator as well as a designer/instructor in the activity thrown away. what really gets me is in the plea, after very minor time served, if they are a good little adult for a period afterwards, they can get it removed from the record and not have to go on the abuser list. This horrifies me that the legal system allows this. and from the legal docyuments posted on reddit, it has happened to someone else, thus making them eligible to teach groups again. this to me is a HUGE flaw in our already screwed up legal system. It is however why the person targeted on reddit is still working with a corps.

This is an interesting discussion. Looking at the bigger picture of corps repertoire historically: - 19th Century corps music sounded like this: - in the early 1900's, Sousa began incorporating "Bugle Trios" in many of his marches, mainly to give the other winds a rest. The Thunderer is a good example. - when "modern" drum corps got rolling after WWI, these open tone tunes were still the norm until Bill Ludwig placed a horizontal valve on the horn. Voila! Enter diatonic marches and even some classics like Commonwealth Edison's Tannhauser and a few pop tunes like Over There, from Irving Berlin's Broadway show. - it's hard to pinpoint when "jazz" entered the picture, but it was probably the early '50s, depending how you define the term. By the middle of that decade, that Murphy cat in Lt. Norman Prince was wowing crowds with Sweet Georgia Brown, and Bobby Adair quickly followed in the Reilly Raiders with Stardust. Latin-inspired music had been around since the late '40's (think Caballeros, founded in '46). Even the Air Force Corps played Perez Prado's Mambo Jambo by the mid-'50s. - as entertainment trumped patriotism in the late '60s and into the '70s, Mangione and Tower of Power became source material. (The hippest version of Squib Cakes came from the Iowa cornfields, courtesy of Doc Crosser's Osage Precisionaires.) Capturing a jazz "feel" has always been a real challenge for corps ensembles, much more so for drums than horns. Given the current infatuation with velocity, there won't be much swinging on the field, and even double time gets crushed to the point of being mechanical. Do not despair, however. The pendulum and the music are sure to swing back.

A Cappy sponsorship could “fill a hole.”

The OP's concern can easily be addressed by contacting each drum corps' BoD and asking to see the policy. Some corps, two I know of, post their policies on their websites. DCI's mission is NOT to address this, and it's just this type of suggestion on which DCI pushes back very hard. Of COURSE DCI, and its staff and volunteers, are in favor of the highest standards of assurance that the kids are not harmed. But it is the member corps, not DCI, that are responsible for having a policy that they actively follow. Having DCI, the org, be some watch-dog for social policy is exactly not the type of central control that the member corps want to endow in DCI or its staff. Each corps survives and thrives on their own, independently. DCI's role is to organize the tour and promote the activity. If the OP has a particular concern with a particular corps, it should be addressed first at the corps. Not on DCP or in DCI. Either the OP is attempting to create a movement for change of something that's not now a problem, or he/she is too lazy to do the work to contact the corps directly. This is a black-eye post no matter how it's sliced. I've never known a more progressive activity than performance art and it's true of DCI as well. OP, there's nothing to see. The petition is for DCi and the member corps to do, WHAT, exactly? And Dan Potter - what's his role in your contention for change? You clearly haven't thought this through and are likely simply a rabble-rouser trying to make smoke where there's no fire. IMO, and with all due respect.

I hear ya, but just the fact that the individual was doing what they did absolutely creeps me out, regardless of where the video was shot.

What that guy did.... just so wrong. On any and all levels. Man.... those Teamsters, and the Longshoremen.... they could be quite effective when called upon to help a friend. My dad also was a Teamster... thankfully nothing like your experience ever happened to me, or my brothers and sister... but if something did, he would have known whom to ask for a favor.

Mike, I gotta be honest here... if I had kids in drum corps, marching band, or whatever activity... I would not want any of them even near an individual like this.

I'm much more interested in what kind of show Madison will come out with for 2018 and what type of costuming will go with that program!! I'd still like to see them do a "Men of Steel" show.

It's the process: someone throws a can of gas and makes a claim and, before long, a crowd forms and starts burning things demanding justice for fictitious wrongs, forcing change in some placation that makes a few feel better and the rest feeling guilty. This thread is a can of gas. I'm here with a fire extinguisher to say: If the petitioner has a claim, bring it forth and don't hide behind the crowd-bating techniques of well-practiced antagonizers. Do the homework to elicit a well-founded accusation and be ready to present facts to either the corps boards, DCI, or the very protective and cynical members of this board. Don't throw your cans of gas here. I'm going to challenge every single accusation that crowd-agitation elicits, and I'm not going to stand by and let fear-mongers demand change and reform in an activity where it's documented to be progressive, accepting, inviting, accommodating, encouraging, and WELCOMING to all kinds and forms of people and personalities. I demand facts, and I will push back hard on straw-men accusations of potentialities. Straw-men burn hot once you ignite them.

I am not suggesting that the petition should be signed, and but this does seem to be a concern of people involved in the activity. I think in light of lessons learned from the Boy Scouts, the Catholic Church and other religious organizations, the YMCA, the Boys and Girls Clubs, and countless other groups, DCI and its member corps should know the safety of youth has to be paramount. A shared policy of protection of minors and hiring practices stating you do not hire people who would not pass a CORI, have been found guilty of sexual misconduct, have lost teaching certifications due to sexual misconduct or are under investigation is common sense and should be current practices of all corps and having all DCI members agree to such a policy and sign it should not be a problem.

Many of you know some or all of corps history so lets hear about them ROYAL COACHMEN...North Tonawanda, NY Started off as the Aristocrats in the early 60's with the Rescue Hose #5 Fire Company and changed the name to the Royal Coachmen. They took their colors (Gold and Black) from the fire company. The corps was a parade corps until 1970 when they did their first competition. As I recall, they surprised everyone with a finalist position at The Penn-York Championships in 1970. The next year the legend, Bill McGrath, wrote the drill and the corps participated in the new season with a brand new director. From 1972 to 75 the corps was always "rebuilding." Staff changes were made and Steve Cooley was with the corps as music arranger for 3 years. Corky Fabrizio wrote the show in 1972. 1976 saw the corps bring in Ted Key (music arranger) and Bob Stone( drill designer) as well as Bill Decker, Doug Kleinhans and Larry Darch on percussion. The year was a successful one with the winning of the NT Open "A" Class title. Sadly, the director resigned the morning the corps left for DCI Champiuonships in Philadelphia. Hotel accomodations were messed up and the corps didn't get to sleep until late. After a couple of hours of sleep and a short rehearsal the corps performed a lackluster performance and failed to make the top 10 of A Class. Returning home, the director came back to the corps and after a winter rehearsal to get ready for the 1977 season he resigned again prior to Memorial Day. The new director decided to merge with another local corps and instead of taking the Royal Coachmen name we took their name of the Frontiersmen. Many senior members left for other corps and the Royal Coachmen were gone! Although corps in NY were dying by then more were to follow...actually ALL of them!

I hear that. My brother-in-law was a sales rep in the trucking industry in NJ, and his territory for a while included the ports in the NYC metro area. He said one of the unwritten rules at the ports was... never, ever mess with the Longshoremen. If you do, you may live... or may not live... to regret it. LOL.

IMO any youth activity - drum corps included, is not the environment for sick perverted, deviant, child sex offenders, especially those who are listed in dru sjodin national sex offenders registry. If an organization can’t find a qualified candidate for any position without hiring a child sex offender is appalling, then DCI should consider screening all applicants for all individual organizations at a set fee or cost to each organization. Establishing the criteria, enforcement parameters and how violations will be handled shouldn’t require a mental giant to setup. There is enough questionable behavior as it is.

Me too. Even though I didn't connect with the design in 2016 and didn't like the 2017 design both of these performances were fantastic. So really the only miss was 2004 for me

The court record does not say where the video was shot, but one of the posts on reddit mentioned that it was in a practice room. It wasn't a girls room, or locker room, or anyplace like that, at least from what was stated. The court document does not mention the locale. I would not have an issue in a case like that. If it had been in a girls locker room, or girls bathroom, etc...I'd be with you.

If, if, if...look how many times you wrote it in just this response. How is it possible that it becomes acceptable that we justify throwing a gas can on a currently-sensitive subject with so many unknowns to back up the contention? OK, so you've identified that people wasting THEIR time making baseless accusations cost you nothing, but it absolutely costs DCI something. It's DCI that, with little justification, has to invest precious time and energy addressing the baseless contentions of any rabble-rouser who decides to launch a can of gas at them. It costs the activity, even if it means that the corps have to leave X amount of dollars in DCI and not for their use in order to address the baseless contentions. Had the OP presented any actual facts in the diatribe that makes up his "petition", I would have given it more due. But his/her M.O. is to only throw the gas can and expect others to clean up the mess.

I'll ignore your invectives. This petition is wrong because you said "IF". "If" DCI is already... "If they need to do more..." Says who? The lawyers? The petitioner? Public pressure? You? Who's responsible for answering "If..."? The accuser, that's who, and no evidence even of current policies has been presented as part of the petition. It's all straw men and fabricated fears. It's the "I demand...!" mentality that's most disturbing when there doesn't seem to be anything to demand change for.

sounds like Congress

horse hockey!! mule fritters

Fascinating. I did the same thing. You and I aren't far apart, trust me. I'm shocked to be a little less-hardlined than you on this, but maybe I shouldn't be. Well, your encouragement of demands for recognition by an accuser to express, what, exactly? That DCI does more? Does he, do you, even know how all of this works as an association of independent organizations? See this is the problem. What, exactly, is being objected to that justifies using an ounce of the very important energy of DCI staff and executives addressing a non-existent problem, the potential for which is addressed by the boards of directors of the individual corps, WHERE THE KIDS ARE! It's a fraternal organization, not a governing body. The power and liability lies in the corps' Boards of Directors, not at DCI offices in Indy. But it's easy to throw a nameless can of gas in a crowd and demand change for allowing fans with gas cans inside. This is the practiced way of agitators. We need to be smarter than them or they will tear this activity apart at the seams.

I hear you, but the fact that Corps are on tours away from home with adults for several weeks on end, does make for extra cautionary due diligence when it comes to hiring adults who are with them in close quarters for weeks on end. I'm unapologetically tough on this. I'm a first strike and you're out kind of guy when it comes to convicted sex offenders. I don't take that " risk ", when it comes to minors, or even young adults. No matter my expected belief that the sex offender might... in my assessment... have a low likelihood of a repeat sex offense to take place again while in my employ. I don't take on that risk. Not on my watch. But if some Corps Director decides too, thats their choice.

As someone who had a brush with a sex offender as a nine year old, and I was sexually harassed by my former boss in my early twenties, I don’t care what drum corps it is. I signed the petition because the very thought of it makes me sick.

Actually you are pretty much forcing all of us to read it by posting it in a public forum, and it is kind of creeping me out a little. I have no reason to believe anyone here is pro-sexual harassment. People may simply disagree about how to best deal with such matters. People may also find the motivations of the oddly surnamed Mr. Petitioner to be suspect and, based on what I have seen on DCP, I understand how they could. This discussion has taken place among people I find to be both likable and intelligent, you and George among them. Let's be respectful and who knows what good might come out of it.

Hmmm...those type of vocalists would certainly fit both WSS and "Candide", not so much "Chichester Psalms", to keep things "Bernstein".

Thank you for mentioning this! I've been on the tempo-is-restricting-musical-choice soapbox for a while, but I think I may have reached "crazy speaker on college campus steps" status with it. Mike

Retain your emotions.

I like a lot of your choices as well My faves: 1. 2009 - Grass is Always Greener. It's a classic, classic program IMHO. Semi and Finals night performances were extremely good 2. 2007 - Triple Crown. From a crowd pleasing standpoint, this one can't be beat! 3. 1995 - Stormworks. Yeah - that was unexpectedly good for a corps in their sixth season and launched them into finals. Saw this program many times that summer - the crowds at local shows just loved it, really impacted their profile and recruitment in coming years 4. 2004 Bohemia! Really set up the next few seasons and the corps became a "for real" power in the activity for the first time (scored over 91 at finals) 5. 2016 Relentless. Incredible performance - that GUARD. that HORNLINE. the MOVEMENT. Unfortunately late season changes (the dud ending) and the beast show out of Coats left them as a lock for third. Shortening the tango, slight expansion of the ballad and a better ending IMO could have put them in a spot to possible keep Coats from winning with "THE show" of the year

1. Hopkins was never supported by the states 2. University of MD is currently supported by the state 3. Yes - all indications are the federal student loan program has led to hyper inflation of college tuition. Not much to "connect" - it just is what it is.

Pfffft. What do you know about it? Mike

Yay Crown! Favorites Out of this World (2014) - I was very disappointed by this show when I first saw it in the theater that year. 2013 was such a wonderful music book that totally captured the "spirit" of the 20th century minimalists, if not the letter. OOTW was a more typical drum corps type program that felt all over the place. As the years have gone on, though, I think they really did not get as much credit as they should have, particularly in the brass - my goodness, this is one of the most well-written and performed brass books ever! Love, love, love the finale with the running upper brass, and they absolutely nailed the opening. Rach Star (2011) - I loved how they integrated the various bits and bobs together. Paint it Black is one of my favorite drum features ever (even managed to transcribe the parts - holy heck!). I know the Band Directors that run marching music turn their nose up at rock, but it *can* be done. (Though it's funny that Crown's idea of "raawwwwwk" are the Stones and Queen - who have been performing for more than and almost 50 years each) Chess...and the Art of Strategy (1996) - this was the first year for "darker" Crown - the purple jackets, and of course, the giant chess set on the field. If only we'd known what props were going to be like 20 years later... The visual design is superb - they use the pieces to great effect throughout the program, popping out and back in to match the darker music. While Nimrod of course is the change of piece ballad, the closer merges Walton and Elgar's music together in a really cool way that just screams "yup, we're done." While Postcards from Britain (1997) was a more technically well-performed show (and Terpsichore is one of my favorite DCI charts ever!), Chess had more heart. A Second Chance (2010) - I love this show so hard. The opening Mahler... wow. Longest mello note ever? Danzon - another of my favorite drum breaks ever. The only thing that keeps this show from being in like my top 3 ever is the finale. Despite being told a million times over the summer "we have a plan," it never felt like they had a plan. Unless presented with undisputable video evidence, I do not believe kind of sort of reprising 2009 was the end goal. That's a minor quibble though - the music in the first 2/3 is so spectacular, I'll forgive just about anything in there! Finis (2008) - Sometimes, it's the seemingly "easy' shows that are the hardest. Peel back the curtain on Crown that year and they are running and gunning as much as any of the other top corps, while making it feel like a stroll in the park. The closer, of course, is an insanely fun game of DCI Music Whack-A-Mole, but pay attention along the way and there is so much to like in what you see and hear. This new "sophisticated" version of Crown may be above a show like this these days, but this program would score high in any year. Honorable Mention Angelus (2005) - the brass the brass the brass the brass the brass the brass the brass ... Not-So-Favorites Bohemia (2004) - yeah, the singing, but the whole back half of the show didn't musically connect to the front half. It never really felt like a full program. Greek Mythology (2002) - let us never speak of this again. Two corps got suckered in by "Javelin" that summer and had bad competitive years (Glassmen). Let's just call it the curse of Michael Torke and move on.

Morally, I'm with Stu. Legally, I agree with you G. There's a misconception about what "DCI" really is. It's not the NFL, with a central league office owned by the stakeholders. The office itself is just a sanctioning body that runs contests. DCI's obligation to the corps is to provide them a basic framework for what happens on the field and secure (some) venues for them to perform. Everything else that happens the corps decide on DCI's behalf. "DCI the organization" tries very, very hard to stay out of each individual corps' operations, except for the basic audit of "do we think this corps can afford to compete?" The corps want it that way, and they've structured the org that way. If you have a beef and want to create a petition, make it towards the Cadets corps we're trying to avoid naming. Mike p.s. Sorry to echo what's already been said - started my reply and got called away, then y'all said pretty much the same things while I was gone...

Just got word from Mt. Diablo that Justinian Rudolpho Himmelsbacker has acknowledged almost-a-Doctor Cappy's pledge for a sponsorship for the Blue Devils for 2021 and will see that the monies go appropriately to BDC knowing Cappy's admiration. JH has thus also decreed for public knowledge of all that BD C is actually named for and will remain so as BD C (short for Cappybara.)

Great summary, George, of what the other George said while the nation watched the World Series, counted its Halloween candy, and reflected on the events in NYC's tragedy yesterday afternoon. Remembering the 8 of Cadets' 2017 vocal ensemble gave me a poignant image of the 8 lives lost yesterday. I remembered the several times the Cadets' buses drove down those same streets and walk ways, especially for boarding the boat to the Statue of Liberty re-dedication. Peace to all effected yesterday; hope to all trying out for auditions for 2018.

some updates on Cadets from online information 1. 4 vocalist used in 2018 - they will not be a choir - but will move around the field and act as pop/jazz vocalist more so than the religious "choir" (static in the pit) approach of 2017 2. corps has several hundreds registered for the first (early) camp at MetLife stadium - with more registering daily -- corps is hosting a total of six audition camps, 3 November and 3 December 3. corps has about 25 brass line spots and about 12 guard spots and approximately 15-18 or so percussion spots; the corps overall has many more returning members than they did entering into 2017 - with brass line in particular being much more vet-laden and the guard having most "weapons" members returning 4. design team meetings begin Monday night and occur every-other week going forward My take: I'm glad the corps is experiencing heavy returns and interest. I'm glad they are holding more camps and clearly going the "aggressive route" on recruitment. They need to build the overall experience and talent level of the corps in 2018. I not excited about the return of vocalists - frankly I don't enjoy them in most instances in this activity (nor do most fans IMHO) - but last year given the material it "made sense" - and except where they got carried away from a design element the "choir" did add to the program. However - I'm not sure why the insistence to stick with vocalist in 2018. Anyway - for those looking for some information on 2018 Cadets - there ya go. Expect some big audition #s and an older, more experienced 2018 corps. And yes - vocalists will play a role, albeit a rather different one than in "Mass" - design team and instructional team remains largely intact - however "concept" team has been reinforced as well as some new and additional techs

Oh I understand. Yep, I get it. A real life farce of governance where the inmates running the asylum is not just a fictional play but the actual governance structure of DCI.

I never named anyone; and if CA law sees sexual offense which is deserving sexual offender registration as merely a misdemeanor that certainly does explain the attitude in Hollywood over the years. So, I will slightly amend and ask George if there has ever been a convicted sex offender 'knowingly' secured by a corps as a staff member who interacts with the youth performers. If not the answer is no; if so the answer is yes.

ouch - the federal student loan program was one of the worst creations ever by the federal government - just drove tuition and teacher salaries WAY up. Hopkins was $4500 a year when I attended (all in) and we just paid cash (I had a scholastic ride) - and that was one of the most expensive Universities. MD at that time frame was FT $450 a semester

They used it for soccer. And with Music City now World Class there may be a compellingly case to be made.

Every org I've ever been involved with has a policy addressing this issue. OP needs to understand who makes decisions in DCI (hint: it's not Dan Potter). Straw men arguments on this subject are not acceptable. Present your concerns directly to the BoD of the org you're referencing.

Perhaps a laurel... and hearty handshake? ($1 to "Blazing Saddles")

Thank you. Do I get a certificate for completion of training?

Anyhooo....any corps that doesn't take this very seriously and take precautionary measures is setting themselves up for a problem.

Jazz has been gone for years. I would pay big money to attend a drum corps show with diverse styles such as Jazz, Spanish, British, & Scottish. Gosh how I miss the show and uniform diversity of the '70's and '80's.

80, 90, 91,2001, 2002 ( that never gets enough credit #### i need room for 89 and 79 too. oh crap and 84-86.

As does Spirit of Atlanta.

'78, '79, '80.... videos, like videos of corps shows from today, do no justice to these shows. Live is so much better than watching via videos... and the audio/ video reproductions from the 70's/ 80's were absolute pure crapp.... especially compared to todays audio reproduction capabilities,. In more recent years, 2012, 2013 were SOA shows that were terrific, imo

1980, peak Spirit, wow! (1979 was good too but 1980 was the better version) 1985 – Concerto in F, introduced that piece to me, one of my favorite shows that year 2003 – Probably liked the idea and their making finals that year better than the show as I have not gone back to watch that show in years. I will say, I thought the tribute flags were hokey and made me roll my eyes but the rest was cool 2012 – Sin City, there were back again. Fun show, complete package 2013 - Speakeasy, more of their 3 year run of quality, entertainment preformed at a high level Least favorite 2008 and 2009, 2009 had so many issues and missed opportunities

Favorites 1. 1980- after tragically loosing Jim Ott they dedicated the rest of the season to him. I love the devil went down to Georgia and this whole show. It's amazing to me how in 1980 the brass section can sound so balanced and beautiful in parts of the show and so big dirty and jazzy in other parts without getting too edgy. 2. 1979- If you haven't watched One night in August I highly recommend it. SOA had a fantastic show in 1979. Their goal was to be on the top 3 and they never have made it to a medal. 3. 1978- the jump from 23 to 6. They hired Jim Ott and Tom Float. 4. 2012- Sin City. I saw this show live at DCI finals and it was one of my favorites of the night. 5. 2013- speakeasy- I love the dirty southern jazz. HMs 2009- live in concert. A nice little rock themed show with some good stuff from Kansas. Any show with dirty southern jazz. Least favorite 2016- Georgia...it just didn't do it for me. Here's to SOA and their fantastic history...may they one day earn a medal and may the show they medal with be full of flutter tounging and plunger mutes...and may they win the Jim Ott award the year they finally get that medal.

Regiment quietly added recent age-out David Warren to their staff. http://regiment.org/staff/david-warren/