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You seem so unhappy anymore.. Yes - all those things have been done elsewhere. Gotta be honest - I was considering world class DCI (Clearly) BD's opening move last year (wave) came from a dance troop. Slides have been used before (Coats). Banners used before (Crown). Trampolines used in both WGI and BOA etc etc... Used in new and different ways is often today's mark of innovation. Which was the point I was making. There is a difference between innovation/creativity and "first time ever" Now cheer up!

My favorite Genesis show was "Selling England by the Pound". It was the last time I saw Peter Gabriel live with Genesis.

Semi-naked man sitting still throughout most of a show?

More of an observation than a criticism. I'm not trying to start a Hop bashing party I promise. I'm very much looking forward to what they do in 2017 with some fresh blood being injected into them. (uh oh did I just hype???)

1986 Spirit of Atlanta

I voted for "Hell Hath No Fury" because I really enjoyed the show and thought it was well done, but think 2013 may have been their most significant show. In 2013 I think Genesis demonstrated it meant business and for me, at least seemed to be a huge jump from 2012.

Here's the staff as listed on their historical archive: Staff Members: Director: G.R. Royer Brass: Rick South, Gordon Henderson, Marty Rhees Percussion: Ralph Hardimon, Glen Crosby, Kent Cater, Lee Rudnicki, Robbie Tompkins, Bob Morrison, Jeff Lee Color Guard: Wes Cartwright, Sheri McGinnis, Kathy Magee Drill Design: Myron Rosander Visual: Myron Rosander, Len Kruszecki, Dan DiLullo, Loren Schneider Drum Majors: Gary Butera, John Meng Guard Captain: Juliette Tandoc

Think you might be a little hoarse by the end of that one, Fran?

I believe the post meant since they went from 11th to 9th in one year, that it would be odd for them to drop out of finals. Blue Knights have been pretty consistent though! As for the Blue Stars dropping out, it's completely within the realm of possibility. I don't think most would have thought Madison was going to miss finals in 2016 after being 11th in 2014, 8th in 2015, and then dropping out in 2016.

I think he's saying there is a scenario in which any one of them could make it in. I agree for the most part. Madison Scouts for sure. Seems like lately when someone gets knocked out they really rebound the next year so I expect them to be more than in the fight. Troopers have been on the cusp for 4 years now...that's gotta be tough. They're always one aspect away. If they all line up it'd be hard to keep them out. Blue Devils B...we'll see. In the 2015 offseason months the conversation was VERY similar and they had a readjusting year as well around 17th - 20th I believe. With a large chunk of I think visual staff heading to Madison Scouts this year I suspect we might see something similar. But maybe not. I think their Open Class show last year was the best OC show I've ever seen in terms of performance quality and probably could have made finals in the very recent past. When the stars line up it's scary. I think Colts have the performance capability...need to see another show before I include them in my conversation. Just needs something a little more defined and that stands out from the very crowded group. Mandarins have the show design down. It's all about gradually increasing the depth and difficulty over a few seasons. Not sure if I see it in 2017 but 2018 and on if they move up again? Game on. Oregon Crusaders are a great visual program away from shooting up really fast. They have the absolutely fantastic creativity and uniqueness down music design wise and they can play the crap out of their shows, just gotta get the visual program on the same level. When that happens I feel like they'll shoot up really fast.

Several years ago Under Armour refused a request by DCI to co-brand some athletic wear, stating that drum corps is not an image that fits their market focus. I can imagine the jockstraps in their Board room now: "Stupid band kids. Do we really want to dilute our image with a bunch of band kids?" I've refused to buy their gear ever since, and have even rejected gifts of their stuff based on their attitude towards drum corps. I'm more than a little surprised that so many drum corps MM's and fans wear the UA logo. To me it's crap if it's too good for band kids. Nothing has made me happier than to see their stock price get slammed due to lower earnings and the realization that the "Athleisure" market they helped create is not immune to the competition of the market. To he11 with Under Armour, the stock, and the bus they rode in on, IMO. This is the prettiest picture: From a high of about $53 in October, 2015 to just over $20 today... Maybe if they include some band kids in their marketing their sales would would look better, eh? (disclaimer: this is not an endorsement, recommendation, or offer to buy or sell UA stock. The opinion expressed here is mine alone and does not represent the opinion of DCP, DCI, UAA, or my company. Past performance is not indicative of future results. Wash behind your ears and wear clean underwear, so long as it's not UA.)

I have one word for you - BEEF!

Heres another one, 1988 Star of Indiana....

2010 gave us Little Jeffery yet 2011 gave us Angles so I am hoping 2017 will give us something special and exciting and not a Hee-Haw type of show. although a few cows and knee slapping music wouldn't be so bad... or would it???

While anythings possible, are you are that the last time that Phantom Regiment failed to make finals was in 1973 ? 44 years ago ?

1. Crown 2. Scv 3. Bd 4. Bcoats 5. Cavis 6. Phantom 7. Cadets 8. Bk 9. Star 10. Boston 11. Crossmen 12. Madison

Not sure why you would think a new staff will automatically ### it up? My feeling FWIW was the previous staff and especially George thought they earned a spot in the top 3 and could do stupid things like Tull, Jingle Bells, Little Jefferey and still be competitive because they could brass/drum/march so well. A little wake up call may be what was required...

if it's an 8-10 person group singing throughout an entire show, then i sure haven't seen it before. whether you call it innovation or anything else, the cadets have been doing something in a way other corps haven't when they won their last 2 championships. actually, i'd say that about most of their championships. not sure i'll ever be onboard with a dedicated vocal ensemble, but i've felt that way about some of my favorite shows...until i actually saw them.

I could care less about "innovative". I just want to like the show. FWIW I think I will -- but I"m holding out the possibility that they bollocks it up -- again!!

I didn't start the thread. I was simply agreeing that it didn't seem unreasonable to think an entity would reply to a customer's email. But thanks as usual for your overreaction.

My heart sinks when I think of the answer to 1989...

I'm sure proud of your timing! What I wrote took about 1 minute too. But yeah, it's better to just start a new thread on DCP and ##### about DCI, because DCI sucks and we should come to DCP when they don't meet our requirements of how they should handle things. I apologize Mikk3, it was wrong of me to point out that the items you're #####ing about could have been found with a simply click on the DCI website. Down with DCI!

I don't see BK and Phantom dropping out, but Blue Stars for sure. As I'm looking at info I have from corps, recordings from camps, staff changes here is my revised list: 1. Blue Devils 2. SCV 3. Cavaliers 4. Bluecoats 5. Crown 6. Cadets 7. Blue Knights 8. Phantom 9. Madison 10. Boston 11. Crossmen 12. Academy

Innovate: to introduce something new; make changes in anything established (Innovate, n.d.). So since everything you've mentioned isn't "something new" or changed in something established, it wouldn't really be counted as innovative. I don't believe in being innovative simply for the sake of the word. There's only so much "innovating" that can be done in drum corps nowadays besides changing your entire uniform, sliding off ramps, or pushing around covered wagons on the field. It would probably be better if you said exactly what was on your mind instead of leaving people to infer what we think you meant, less you look like the hype machine. I am not exactly sure where you're getting any unhappiness from me as I really have nothing about which to be unhappy. The phrase was simply pointing out how important it is to know history which seems to be relatively forgotten nowadays. Reference: "Innovate." Dictionary.com. Dictionary.com, n.d. Web. 08 Feb. 2017. <http://www.dictionary.com/browse/innovate?s=t>.

My rationale being BD really has the consistency over all others. Cadets understand their traditional run and gun look what we can do style no longer scores GE. Last year they began a process to reinvent. Mistakes made but still a formidable corps of talent with a renewed emphasis to get it right. SCV- I just feel all the parts have been there for a while and with their improvements in brass, they're a design away from challenging. Crown I really love but stylistically, getting a bit routine and without that championship guard, may drop a tad (or not).. Bloo design team really gambled last year and nailed it. They're cool but risky. They could dominate or flop design wise. Cavaliers- should ride on their strength from 2016 but I still feel they benefited as much from the Cadets crash n burn season as from a solid Cavies corps. BK I loved 2015 but not as much 2016. They can surge or flop. Talent yes, just looking for that Magic design again. Crossmen, Phantom, BAC- I think a solid group here that can battle all season. BAC perhaps winning our this group IF that potential guard caption rises year one of new program. Seems tons of Crownguard moved with staff so will help. If that changes, new programs can take 2+ years to develop. Academy momentum? Madison smart re prioritizing?

And don't forget the trumpet soloist and violinist.

Since 2011, they have been 11, 13, 12, 9, 11, 9, not really an upswing, but more inconsistent. I could easily see them dropping out of finals.

Just went to the DCI website, and I officially don't understand what the problem is. This thread was started by accusing DCI of not giving information on when tickets will be released, but if you simply click on the "TICKET" tab to the right of the show info on the schedule, you can order for both Oceanside and Pasadena. The option is not currently available for Riverside, but is also not there for 61 other various events on the DCI schedule. I realize you want to be able to take care of tickets for all 3 events you plan to attend, but you can already take care of 2 out of 3. Furthermore, there are more events that do not have ticket info available than currently do.

I assume you used the DCI website that includes the schedule and show information, correct? I mean since they list all necessary contact info pertaining to specific shows, and points of contact, it's fair to assume you did that, right?

He has a picture with Gronk on his Facebook page, and he was live on FB throughout the parade. He is well connected and knows everyone (most of the people I know who know him are not connected to drum corps or Putnam Investments), but what amazes me is he always knows your name. A few years ago at a BAC show the line was longer at the pick up window than sales, Mike went into the ticket booth, grabbed the envelopes, and started handing tickets to people without asking a name, and in most cases he asked a question as he handed out the tickets. In more than a few cases some asked "How does he know me?" Knowing a name goes along way in good public relations which can only help with what he does for BAC.

We're doing TIA winds 3 shows and Championships. Should be fun!

Likewise I've never seen Phantom on stage or screen, and I had to look up "Lot 666" after first seeing Genesis' show, but I realized right away that it must have been an allusion; what a silly mistake for a judge to make. (I am reminded, the other way around, of a marching band judge I overhead in 2015 commenting on one band's show of Michael Jackson music. They closed with "Thriller", ending with a sample of Vincent Price's famous laugh from the original recording. The judge complimented them on their inclusion of that sound effect in a way that made it clear he had no idea that it was a straight lift from the source.)

1979 BD opener with its massive chordal stack at the end. 1982 (not 92) Crossmen; '87 SCV did a bunch of Xmen '82 alums proud.

Good interview today with Genesis Executive Director, Chris Magonigal: http://www.flomarching.com/article/51683-from-the-tower-podcast-ep-1-with-chris-magonigal?utm_campaign=General&utm_medium=SocialMedia&utm_source=Facebook&utm_content=Article&utm_term=Ep1FTT020717#.WJqdKD1OLYU

If you don't intend to reply to emails then don't provide an email address. Otherwise you make yourself look like a doofus.

It was great!!!

Let's see, had to check to see if my point in OT. Yep... It is interesting that this situation, not specifically this person's situation with DCI, but the impression (and fact, probably) that DCI doesn't have the staff or capital budget for such solutions because, again IMO, A. The directive that many tasks previously handled by DCI could and should be done by member corps with expertise in that area, and B. All of the money saved by shifting those jobs to member corps results in a larger pie to split among member corps at the end of the season. Those more experienced, do I have that right? I get the point: DCI's prime objective is to return as much money as possible to the corps, not spend it on marketing or t-shirts or show production or fancy phone systems that the member corps do better than the inept, temporary, low-paid help that inhabits the DCI offices. (My impression, not necessarily any director's statement.) But I also think that the egos of some directors has blinded them to the potential benefits of pooling assets and interests for the benefit of all participants. "Institutional Arrogance", I've heard it described from within the hallowed halls. I don't claim to have all the any answers, but something tells me that this DCI is the one they get when they strip it of the assets, capital, support, and combined assistance to execute the plan they entrusted to them. (And then stripped the plan!) I remember more than one strategic plan goal of building a $something-million budget surplus that never seemed to get primary goal status. I, personally, think that DCI should be the first and primary contact for any and all fans who wants to know about the details of any show on the circuit. But that's my opinion and I don't run a drum corps.

Yes! Fantasy Drum Corps is back. I mean cmon this WAS the reason for season long recaps.

Garfield appeared simply to be enjoying Karma! It always seems to manifest itself eventually.

Not great news, Fran, but at least they'll be doing something, (Minis, Soundsport, both?) which is better than folding. Performing in what venues and manner you can perform effectively in is always good.

Lots of assumptions here, garfield, and all those assumptions of yours seem to accrue to the benefit of CC, but not to Boston. Why ?.. While your asumptions on this could be proven correct down the line, what evidence have you seen that the former CC marchers owe CC any more monies at all ? Who assumes the contract is valid in the first place ? Not the parties. Not DCI. Noone here on DCP. The Law ( courts ) do. I'm not saying that what CC has done here is illegal. I'll assume for the sake of discussion here that it is legal. But so long as this matter is settled either amicably, or legally, the assumption that DCI is the final arbiter as who is eligible to transfer between Corps, and march where they want to march, may or may not ultimately rest with DCI at all. For example, If Boston decides to foot the former CC marchers bill ( not saying they would, nor even should), DCI would have no reason to even intervene on this, let alone deny their eligibilty to march the Corps of their freely chosen choice, and in which they might have secured a spot in line.

When was this announced?

I don't think the non-profit halo insulates the business practices from the same legal restrictions on what cannot be enforced. After all, the kids are still in effect purchasing an educational product from the corps - it's a business relationship like any other. Let's look at an analogy outside the non-profit world: You purchase a one year membership at Costco for 2017 (= 1 year membership with Crown) As an incentive for first-time members, or perhaps because it is a newly opened Costo in your town, they waive the annual fee for 2017 (= Crown giving a scholarship [not some alumni] for the year's tuition) You receive for one year a product of financial discounts on merchandise in their store (= the member receives the product of musical education) You're not required to renew the contract at the end of the year (= you're not required to march next year; in fact, under Crown's own policy on their website, you are not even guaranteed the chance to march the following year, but are in fact required to audition all over again!) But if you don't renew the membership with Costco, and instead take out a membership with BJs in 2018, you will be sent a bill for the 2017 annual membership they waived. As you said - you haven't paid for my legal opinion, and you are getting what you paid for here, but I don't think Costco would be able to enforce such a provision because I believe it would be a violation of anti-trust law. Frankly, I think the DCI policy would be even more problematic for many reasons which would bring up other policy restrictions on contract, including: (1) failure to pay back that discount could actually prevent you under DCI rules from marching elsewhere, (2) the fact that the corps is not even guarantying you the right to march with them next season, but is imposing a financial penalty if you march elsewhere, (3) the already existing limited window of opportunity to march with any corps due to age restrictions, which would set the bar even higher on additional restrictions of movement. I'm certain there is probably a hefty body of case law on the subject with regard to the academic world of scholarships and transfers, and I really do not believe a DCI corps would be able to distinguish themselves from those situations very easily.

Your answer shows you still have class.

Isn't it the true spirit of a donation? To donate, not for self indulgent accolades, but to help. It is disingenuous to me to make a donation with a stipulation saying here you go kid, but you owe me.

The word " scholarship " was utilized in the legal language of the contract. The term " debt forgiveness " was not utilized in the CC contract because a " debt forgiveness ", is not a " scholarship ". For example, hundreds of H.S. football players just signed College Letters of Intent this week to receive " Scholarships " to play football at Div.1a Colleges. The football " scholsarship " is not " debt forgiveness " as there is no personal " debt " for the future player. There is no " debt " as they have not yet set foot on the football field to practice, let alone play at the " scholarship " providing institution. So there is nothing to "forgive " the " scholarship " winner with. Furthermore, once the player fulfills the responsibilities of the "scholarship".. goes to practice, follows the team rules, etc, and leaves the school at the end, he does not owe the school the " scholarship " monies back. Even if the player decides to transfer from Texas to Oklahoma ( a firece football rival ) Texas is not going to turn that players " scholarship" into a punitive " payment on demand bill ". Not only is Texas not going to do so for just ethical reasons and good PR reasons, they are going to make sure they don't do it for legal reasons. The NCAA prohibits any of its member organizations to turn a " scholarship " into a " payment on demand " bill. So to this extent, CC probably should utilize another phrase than " scholarship " in its contracts, as you and I both now agree this phrase " scholarship " does not even have Webster Dictionary definition of something that needs to be future " paid back ".

I ask this with absolute respect to corpsband, Garfield, and anyone else...and it is something I joked about a few pages back: Suppose the fictitious Boston Crown Cadets Corps decided to take its $3500 fee, increase that fee by another $3500, but then give each member a "scholarship" back of $3500 with the condition of those members never marching elsewhere or they would owe the scholarship back? Guys, seriously if you follow this idea to its possible conclusion, would that not have the effect of forcing kids to march with one corps for their entire eligibility? I know the example seems absurd, but the methodology is the exact same.

Again that's not the part I think that people are having an issue with. If I just randomly saw this and saw the part where it said "scholarship revoked" I'd think hey that sounds kind of wrong. Not the top half of the email where it said their dues are not fully paid from the previous season. But I digress. I can at least see where people might get kind of a bad vibe from it.

If the scholarship really wasn't a scholarship why was it called a scholarship in the first place? That's where I'm getting quite a bit of confusion myself. I really don't think anyone has an issue with marching members paying off what they owe at a previous corps, I certainly don't.